Nuestros Ranchos Site

Hi Irma, this has always been an interesting topic to discuss, I think that many people have reasons and times to shorten their names, I have a sister from church and the FHC her name is still Ruiz de Esparza, she is from Cosío, Ags. We just call her sister Esparza, its customs like this that might a reason, I wasnt aware you were related to Vic. Ferr I have him in my database along with all the G. de Mendoza. Anyway I think it really just depends on the person, a general from Santa María de los Lagos, was named Moreno de Ortega, they later changed the city's name ti Lagos de Moreno in his honor. He used his European-style surname till the end of the war of independece when he died. My grandfather told me once, I need to ask him again! Ill just paraprase what I remember, that there was a time the Mexican government tried to get rid of all compound last names, but were not successful, it was an effort to create equality, since the compound showed lineage and blood, but it failed, in the government were the criollos in charge. I think the independece didnt really change things, yes, it kicked the peninsulars but put the criollos in power where it is today.

-Daniel Méndez del Camino

_________________________________________________________________
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Stuart,
I have a situation where I do have father and mother for the great, great, great grand-parents. However, while the father's side is OK, the maternal grandparents are listed as "abuelos maternos no conocidos." One of the children does have a grandmother.

Should this be interpreted as the grandmother was unwed? I am a little bit confused. Can you help me with this? Do you want names? Thank you for any help you can give me.

--Esther Jordan Lopez

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
treinta y uno de Henero 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india originaria de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fueron sus padrinos
Simon Benites y Juana de Lara, á quienes advertí su obligación y
parentesco espiritual, y lo firme con dicho Señor Cura

This record is very typical for children of unknown parents, and the
padrinos named here happen to be my wife's direct-line ancestors. I
wonder what the relationship was between Antonia and her godparents,
when there are no other parents known. Did the godparents assume
responsibility for raising the child? Did they merely fine her a home?
Did they do little or nothing but allow their names to be written
down? Just how seriously did godparents take "su obligación y
parentesco espiritual"?

--
Best regards,
Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com

Stuart,
sometimes the child(ren) of PNCs were the bastard child(ren) of the
"Padrino" and occasionally of the "Madrina." Marge

On Jun 17, 2009, at 8:34 AM, Stuart Armstrong wrote:

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
treinta y uno de Henero 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india originaria de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fueron sus padrinos
Simon Benites y Juana de Lara, á quienes advertí su obligación y
parentesco espiritual, y lo firme con dicho Señor Cura

This record is very typical for children of unknown parents, and the
padrinos named here happen to be my wife's direct-line ancestors. I
wonder what the relationship was between Antonia and her godparents,
when there are no other parents known. Did the godparents assume
responsibility for raising the child? Did they merely fine her a home?
Did they do little or nothing but allow their names to be written
down? Just how seriously did godparents take "su obligación y
parentesco espiritual"?

--
Best regards,
Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com

Estimado Stuart buenos días.

Cualquiera de las preguntas que haces puede ser la respuesta.

La obligación para con los padrinos era más que nada espiritual, dependiendo de sus posibilidades ellos podían llevar o no a los niños a sus casas. Los niños podían quedar bajo la custodia de Iglesia mientras se les buscaba un hogar pero el bautismo era algo que no podía ni debía postergarse ya que la muerte asechaba todo el tiempo. Por eso se les buscaba padrinos con urgencia para poder bautizarlos.

Casi siempre esos infantes toman los apellidos de los padrinos, puedes buscar que pasó con esa niña, pudo haber muerto ya que el íncice de mortalidad era muy alto o puedes buscar en los expedientes matrimoniales si es que se casó, es en esos documentos en donde se encuentra la mayor información útil para cualquier investigador o genealogísta ya que las partidas de libros de bautismo, matrimonio y entierros son muy breves.

El índice de niños hijos de padres no conocidos e Hijos de la Iglesia es muy alto durante el virreinato la historia de Antonia la niña que mencionas, fue bastante común. Eran hijos nacidos de relaciones ilísitas desde el punto de vista legal o moral, de abusos, etc. Por ello eran abandonados en los pueblos cercanos, para ocultar "el pecado".

Rodolfo Sinaí Gómez

> Date: Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:34:19 -0600
> From: stuartarms@gmail.com
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] de padres no conocidos
>
> En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
> treinta y uno de Henero 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india originaria de el
> Pueblo de San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fueron sus padrinos
> Simon Benites y Juana de Lara, á quienes advertí su obligación y
> parentesco espiritual, y lo firme con dicho Señor Cura
>
> This record is very typical for children of unknown parents, and the
> padrinos named here happen to be my wife's direct-line ancestors. I
> wonder what the relationship was between Antonia and her godparents,
> when there are no other parents known. Did the godparents assume
> responsibility for raising the child? Did they merely fine her a home?
> Did they do little or nothing but allow their names to be written
> down? Just how seriously did godparents take "su obligación y
> parentesco espiritual"?
>
>
> --
> Best regards,
> Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com
>

David Serna I have taken it to be the the " area of origin " perhaps not defining the exact rancho, or defining where the birth records are located. I would expect to find the birth record in the " Originario " location.
I could see this being misleading if a person were nacido in Zacatecas, lived for 2 yrs ; at a young age moved to Aguascalientes for 15 years; then moved to Teocaltiche,Jalisco where he ended up marrying.
I would expect the marriage document to say Originario de Aguascalientes.

Sin duda la palabra "originario" es sinonimo de "nacido en", quizas haya algun error al escribir el registro por la persona que lo efectuo, como muchos otros errores importantisimos que hemos encontrado atravez de la investigacion de los registros originales de nuestros ancestros, un saludo y si alguien mas tiene comentarios adicionales, bienvenidos.

Joseph,

Salvador Cabral Valdés is an active member and I believe moderator of the
group GENEALOGIA DE MEXICO. I don't think he is a member of NR.

Bill Figueroa

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Puentes"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, June 17, 2009 9:45 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] salvadorcabral

Is SalvadorCabral part of the NR group? I found this on Rootsweb and
wondered if I need to invite this person or if he/she is already part of
the group. Is this possibly you: Sylvia H Corona?

Dear R Cordova,

sorry, I don't know what your given name is, so I'll use R. Cordova

I believe that most of us transcribe records from films that we order via our family history centers through the Mormon Church.

We order the films from Salt Lake City, receive them at our local centers and take the time necessary to view them, copy, photograph or scan them and then transcribe the findings from those films on to a database.

It sounds like you're off to a good start, you have ordered and viewed your first film and already found and made a connection. If you keep that film on permanent loan at your local family history center, you'll most likely be able to look at it again few years from now and will be able to find more records of ancestors in your family tree. When viewing records early on, it's difficult to gauge who's family and who's not.

I hope I answered your question.

Alicia,
San Jose, Calif

________________________________
From: "rcordovamba@aol.com"
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 12:07:03 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Records

Sigue en espanol.

I am new to genealogy. I ordered my first film from my local family history center. I guessed about the year and the place. However, I was lucky and found a relative. I ordered baptism records from San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco (1855-1857).

Some members of Nuestros Ranchos have mentioned that they have transcribed records and post them here or that they have finished the records and post them here. Where are these records transcribed from? Does this entail reviewing films or going to the actual site to review original records?
Excuse my ignorance, but since I am reviewing this records anyway, how could I help the members of Nuestros Ranchos?
______

Soy nueva en genealogia. Ordene mi primer microfilm del centro de historia. No sabia cual ordenar ni siquera sabia la ciudad. Por fortuna encontre a un pariente. Ordene los records de bautizo de San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco de 1855 a 1857.

He visto que algunos miembros de Nuestros Ranchos han comentado que transcriben records o que los han terminado y luego los postean aqui. De donde provienen estos records? En que consiste esto, consiste en revisar los microfilmes o en ir al lugar donde estan los records originales y transcribirlos de alli?

Disculpen mi ignorancia, pero quisiera ayudar a los miembros de Nuestros Ranchos ya que si reviso un microfilme, tengo que leerlo de todos modos.

R Cordova

Dear R..

 
The 3 films I transcribed were from Jerez Zacatecas and are in the film section.  I digitally photographed them but deleted each record and only kept the transcription.  The thousands of photo's I took were taking up too much room on my computer and it was the translation I was interested in. Everyone does them differently I would assume.. I only make copies of direct ancestors.
 
Linda in B.C.

--- On Tue, 6/16/09, rcordovamba@aol.com wrote:

From: rcordovamba@aol.com
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Records
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 12:07 AM

Sigue en espanol.

I am new to genealogy. I ordered my first film from my local family history center. I guessed about the year and the place. However, I was lucky and found a relative. I ordered baptism records from San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco (1855-1857).

Some members of Nuestros Ranchos have mentioned that they have transcribed records and post them here or that they have finished the records and post them here. Where are these records transcribed from? Does this entail reviewing films or going to the actual site to review original records?
Excuse my ignorance, but since I am reviewing this records anyway, how could I help the members of Nuestros Ranchos?
______

Soy nueva en genealogia. Ordene mi primer microfilm del centro de historia. No sabia cual ordenar ni siquera sabia la ciudad. Por fortuna encontre a un pariente. Ordene los records de bautizo de San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco de 1855 a 1857.

He visto que algunos miembros de Nuestros Ranchos han comentado que transcriben records o que los han terminado y luego los postean aqui. De donde provienen estos records? En que consiste esto, consiste en revisar los microfilmes o en ir al lugar donde estan los records originales y transcribirlos de alli?

Disculpen mi ignorancia, pero quisiera ayudar a los miembros de Nuestros Ranchos ya que si reviso un microfilme, tengo que leerlo de todos modos.

R Cordova

Hi there. If anyone knows...I noticed that Tijuana and Ensenada are listed in the BC Sur records. Does anyone know if there is a separate index for BC Norte? I am specifically in need of Mexicali, BC Norte. I know that Mexicali was not incorporated until the 1902-1905, or so...but one of my branches was established there in the 1930's.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Gracias!

Thank you Daniel,
I was looking at the films for the Misón de Santa Gertrudis, Baja California
Sur on Friday at the Family History Library in Salt Lake City, Utah. Now I
can look at them from home! Thanks for the heads up!

On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 8:07 PM, wrote:

> Hi everyone, I just wanted to say that the family search pilot now has the
> Baja California Sur Catholic records 1750-1983 so it might help someone out
> there.
> http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#p=allCollections;…

Elisa,
I am in the Library every day, (some Saturdays no Sundays, library is
closed) ask for me at the research counter and (someone will find me) and
I'll help you out my name is Eduardo H Seoane I will not be there this
coming Wednesday.

The rest of the group can ask me anything and if I have the time I will be
more than happy to help. If you have personal requests make sure to email me
directly, but if you have requests that the group would benefit from hearing
or can help solve then go ahead and post it on the Nuestros Ranchos website
so that all can benefit from the answer. Furthermore, be advised that I
might post some of the Q & A that we engage in on the Nustros Ranchos
website if I feel others might benefit from the information; I will advise
you first of my intentions.

Saludos desde Lago Salado,

Eduardo H Seoane

most of my ancesters (back to the mid-1500s) are from Jalisco. What area and surnames are you researching?

Jose Carlos de Leon

EMAILING FOR THE GREATER GOOD
Join me

> To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: elisaakamommy@gmail.com
> Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 21:05:02 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Researching in Ojuelos, Jalisco
>
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I'm brand new to this forum and would like to know if there is anyone out there who is researching in the same area as I am? I live in Salt Lake City and go to the Family History Library once a week. I am very willing to help anyone out who needs it. I am hoping that there is someone who is familiar with this area of Jalisco and could give me a few pointers or useful historical info. Thanks.
>
> elisaakamommy

Here is the first installment of my transcriptions (more properly
"Interpretations") of christening records of Ags. This group of
records begins with christenings from la hacienda de Santiago de
Guadalupe, feligresía de la Villa de Aguascalientes, beginning in
1726. They are the first christening records of the area. (Prior to
1726 they were recorded in the Aguascalientes Sagrario volumes, going
back to about 1601.) Some of these are specifically marked Labor de
Santiago, but most are Hazienda de Santiago. Some of the baptisms were
apparently performed in San José de Gracia (usually written San
Joseph), or Paredes (sometimes written Paderes), or Pabellón, or a few
other places, as noted. Often the origin (birthplace) of the child is
given also, and sometimes the age. Most of the records also give the
caste or race designation, which I have found does not always agree
with the race recorded when the same children got married.

This project is a learn-as-you-go exercise, so the quality of my
interpretations improves as I progress through the records. At least I
think so. Punctuation is a bit random, and usually omitted, or added
for clarity according to my whim and fancy .

* = entered into my database.
+ = entered into my database as a research note.
You can ignore or delete these designations.

... = omitted boilerplate text.
___ = unknown characters that are hidden in the gutter of the bound volume
( ) = text that is uncertain, or clarifying comments

The image filenames come from the pilot familysearch website, and are
the default filenames that appear when you save an image.

Corrections welcome. But remember: these are interpretations, so I
might not agree with you .

If anyone wishes to archive these on Nuestros Ranchos ... feel free -
I don't have time to do it.
========================================================

========================================================
Interpretations of Christening Records of Aguascalientes

Source: Mexico Aguascalientes Catholic Church Records, Rincón de
Romos. Bautismos en la Parroquia de San José de Gracia, 1726-1762
(pilot.familysearch.org, images 1 -221, image files 4340118_277-497)
-----------------------------------------

image filename 4340118_277.jpg (Title page)
Libro en que se asientan los Baptismos que en la Hazienda de Santhiago
se hazen por el Br Dn Joseph de Lomos. Con Licencia al Dr D. Manuel
Colón, de Sarreatiqui, Cura Beneficiado Vicario, Juez Eclesiastio de
la Villa de Aguascalientes, Año de 1733 Rincón de Romos, San José de
Gracia, Bautismos.

image filename 4340118_278.jpg
Memoria de los Baptismos que hecho con
lisencia de el Señor Cura; en esta Hasienda de San Blas de el
Pabellon, de Don Lucas Lopes de Fonseca; perteneciente a la Villa de
Aguas Calientes; en este año de 1726

1 Feb 1726 Francisca hija legitima de Salbador Pedro y Maria de la
Candelaria indios de esta hazienda fueron padrinos Santiago Martín y
Ildefonsa de la Cruz

24 Feb 1726 María de la Candelaria india hija legitima de Francisco
Xabier y Maria de la Encarnación de esta hazienda fueron padrinos
Domingo Sedillo y Paula de la Cruz - Pabellon

24 Feb 1726 Miguel Policronio espanol hijo legitimo de Jasinto Mariano
y Augustina de Barques de esta hazienda fueron padrinos Miguel de
Carrasquilla y Maria de Moncada - Pabellon

5 Marzo 1726 Mathias mulato hijo natural de Ysabel, Esclava, madrina
Maria de la Rosa

image filename 4340118_279.jpg

19 Mayo 1726 Pedro Heron hijo legitimo de Ram(on de) la Cruz y Lorensa
de los Dolores indios de esta hazienda fueron padrinos Juan Martin y
Francisca - Pabellon

29 Mayo 1726 Rafael Martin indio hijo legitimo de Joseph M____ y María
de la Candelaria Pueblo de San Joseph fueron padrinos Salbador
Hernandes y Pascuala de los Relles - Pabellon

2 Junio 1726 Bonifacia Gertrudis mulata libre hija legitima de Pablo
Rodrigues y Teresa Rodrigues mulatos libres de esta hazienda fueron
padrinos Antoniio Gomes y Luci_ de la Trinidad - Pabellon

13 Junio 1726 Joseph Antonio espuesto a Maria Robles padrino Ysidro
____ de esta hazienda - Pabellon

13 Junio 1726 Maria de la Encarnacion hija natural de Paula de Esparsa
de el potr____ fueron padrinos Juan Joseph de Esparsa y Gertrudis de
Santiago - Pabellon

29 Junio 1726 Bernardina de Sena, loba, hija legitima de Juan Caldera
y Seferina asistenes en esta hazienda fueron padrinos Juan (Vas)ques
Maria Basques - hazienda del Pabellon

21 Agosto 1726 Lorenso yndio hijo legitimo de Calletano Peres y Juana
de Arze, asistentes en esta hazienda fueron padrinos Phelipe de
Santiago y Ana de la Cruz - Pabellon

4 Nobiembre 1726 Joseph Feliciano hijo legitimo de padres no conosidos
indio madrina Catharina Gutierres - hazienda de San Blas de el
Pabellon

21 Octubre 1726 Rita Maurina yndia hija legitima de padres no
conosidos fueron padrinos Rita Monica de Texeda - Pabellon

1 Desiembre 1726 Juana Josepha morisca hija Deonicio Fraustro y Maria
Josepha de Rojas fueron padrinos Marcos de Luera y Josepha Carrisco -
Pabellon

2 Feb 1727 Esteban Luciano indio hijo legitimo de Domingo Luciano y
Dominga Venancia fueron padrinos Christobal de Heredia y Maria de la
Candelaria - hazienda del Pabellon

9 Feb 1727 Juan Chrisostomo hijo de padres no conosidos padrino Pablo
Martin - Pabellon

image filename 4340118_280.jpg

9 Feb 1727 Marsela yndia hija legitima de Joseph Crus y Phelipa fueron
padrinos Pablo Martin y Pascuala de los Relles - Pabellon

13 Feb 1727 Maselo indio hijo expuxes de Magdalena fueron padrinos
Lorenso Visente de Salas y Antonia Rodrigues - Pabellon

2 Mar 1727 Ana Maria mulata libre hija legitima de Juan Hernandes y
Maria Rodrigues fueron padrinos Lucas Basques y Melchora de los Reyes
- Pabellon

5 Mar 1727 Pablo yndio hijo legitimo de Juan José de Rallas y Juana
Basques fueron padrinos Geronimo y Maria de la Rosa - hazienda
Pabellon

15 mar 1727 Ana Maria hija legitima de Antonio Manuel y Juliana
(Gert)rudis yndios madrina Phelipa de la Cruz - Pabellon

Siguen los Baptismos de esta Hasienda del Pabellon este año de 1727

22 May 1727 Domingo Peres yndio hijo legitimo de Nicolás Peres y
Phelipa Rodrigues besinos de esta hazienda fueron padrinos Nicolas
Rodrigues y Basilia Rodrigues - hazienda del Pabeyon

26 Jun 1727 Maria de la Trinidad yndia hija espurea Maria de la Cruz
fueron padrinos Joseph Ruvio y Maria de la O.

image filename 4340118_281.jpg - blank pages

image filename 4340118_282.jpg

Memoria de los Bauptismos que sean echo en la hazienda de San Blas del
Pavellon portesensia consedida del SSr Cura de la Villa de Aguas
Calientes Don Carlos de Casasola y son los siguente

13 Ago 1728 Petra Macaria mulata hija de la Yglesia fue su madrina
Jasinta Menois

22 Ago 1728 á Un Ynfante yndio Juan Lusiano hijo e la Yglesia fue su
Padrino Diego Jacobo

28 Dre 1728 Francisca Xaviera Una Yndia de un mes nasida hija legitima
de de Xpal de los Peres y Maria Pasquala fueron padrinos Juan de
Marcon? y Maria de la Cruz

28 Dre 1728 Un ynfante yndio de un mes nasida Francisco Xavier hijo de
la Yglesia fueron padrinos Xpal Coronel y Maria de la Cruz

image filename 4340118_283.jpg

7 henero 1729 yndio de 29 dias nasido Andr__ Nicolas hijo legitimo de
Bartholome Hernz y Francisca He____ fueron padrinos Manuel Lopez y
Efigenia Gregoria

16 henero 1729 yndio 17 dias nasido Juan hijo legitimo de Nicolas
Rodrigues y Basilia Rodrigues fueron padrinos Joseph Rubio y Maria de
la O.

20 henero 1729 yndia Juana hija legitima de X_____ y Maria de los
Dolores fueron padrinos Juan Martin y _____ de los Santos

26 henero 1729 Ynfanta Yndia Paula Gertrudis hija legitima de Lorenso
Suriaco y Maria Dominga fueron padrinos Geronimo de la Cruz y Thomasa
Thadeo

26 henero 1729 ynfanta Paula Gertrudis hija legitima de Pasqual Muños
y Maria de los Dolores fueron padrinos Estevan de los Santos y
Bernarda de la Encarnasion

Andres Martin yndio hijo legitimo de Andres Martin y Maria Cathalina
fueron padrinos Joseph Calsada y Josepha Ruiz - San Blas del Pavellon
8 Dizre 1729

ynfante español Pedro Nolasco hijo legitimo de Caietano Argandoña y
Maria de Reza fueron padrinos Francisco Romo y Nicolasa Lechuga - San
Blas del Pavellon 31 henero 1730

Juliana Francisca hija legitima de Francisco Martin y Josepha Martin
fueron padrinos Phelipe Ramires y Caietana Ramires - San Blas del
Pavellon 8 Febrero 1730

Plasida hija legitima de Juan de LLamas y Maria Flores fueron padrinos
Gaspar de Heredia y Theresa Rodriguez - San Blas de Pavellon 8 Febrero
1730

image filename 4340118_284.jpg

Juan Prudensiano morisco hijo legitimo de Joseph Antonio Cañizares y
Juana Bentura padrino Phelipe de Santiago - San Blas del Pavellon 5
Junio 1729

Antonio Ubaldo mestizo hijo legitimo de Andres Martin y Maria Alvarado
padrino Don Francisco Ygnacio de Bastinzuria - San Blas del Pavellon
11 Junio 1729

Petra Roberta lova hija legitima de Xpal Coronel y Maria de los
Dolores fueron padrinos Juan de Aguado y Maria de San Joseph - en la
hazienda de San Blas del Pavellon 13 Junio 1729

Caietano yndio hijo legitimo de Antonio Manuel y Gertrudis Juliana
fueron padrinos Xpal Perez y Maria de los Dolores - San Blas del
Pavellon 21 Agosto 1729

image filename 4340118_285.jpg

Josepha Elena yndia hija legitima de Salvador Martin y Francisca de la
Cruz fueron padrinos Caietano Serrano y Dominga Hernandez - San Blas
del Pavellon 21 Agosto 1729

Noberta Francisca yndia hija legitima de Pasqual Martin y Maria de la
____ fueron padrinos Juan de Marcon? y Maria de la Cruz - 2 Oct 1729

*Plasido yndio hijo legitimo de Salvador de Jesus y Maria de la
Concepsion fueron padrinos Juan de Dios Quiros y Dominga Benancia -
Blas del Pavellon 9 Oct 1729

Juan Paulino yndio hijo legitimo de Juan Bauptista y Maria Mathiana
fueron padrinos Geronimo Mansina y Thomasa Tha___ - San Blas del
Pavellon 11 Julio 1728 (The year is underlined and initialed with a
"P", probably for Pedro Romo de Vivar, whose signature is affixed to
all of these records)

Juan Phelisiano yndio hijo legitimo de Joseph Antonio y Ygnasia Martin
fueron padrinos Francisco Xavier de Levia? y Maria de la Purificasion
- San Blas del Pavellon 29 Maio 1729 (the year is underlined)

Gregoria Eufrasia coiota hija legitima de Estevan de los Santos y
Bernarda de la Encarnasion fueron padrinos Miguel Geronimo y Maria de
la Rosa - San Blas del Pavellon 26 Marzo 1730 (the year is underlined)

del Pueblo de ___ Joseph de Grazia, Antonio Marzelino español hijo
legitimo de Gaspar de Mendosa y Maria de Guadalupe Masias fueron
padrinos Lorenzo Marin y Juana Bentura - 7 Maio 1730 en esta hazienda
(the year is underlined)

*del Pueblo de San Joseph, Juan Gorge yndio hijo legitimo de Pasqual
de los Reies y Antonia de la Encarnasion madrina Cathalina de Araisa -
San Blas del Pavellon 7 Maio 1730 (the year is underlined)

image filename 4340118_286.jpg

del Pueblo, Miguel Ygnacio hijo legitimo de An____ Marin y Juana
Ramirez fueron sus padrinos Bernab_ __minguez - hazienda de San Blas
del Pavellon 4 Jun 1730 (the year is underlined and initialed)

Gertrudis de Guadalupe yndia hija legitima de Caietano Bazquez y
Antonia de Salas madrina Juana Bentura San Blas del Pavellon __ de
Junio 1730 (the year is underlined)

del Pueblo, Ana Prudenciana yndia hija legitima de Bernabe Dominguez y
Juana Aguaio fueron padrinos Nicolas Hernandez San Blas del Pavellon 7
Junio 1730 (the year is underlined)

Carlos de Borromedo yndio hijo legitimo de Andrea de la Cruz fueron
padrinos Juan Garsia y Josepha Ruiz San Blas del Pavellon 15 Nobiembre
1729 (the year is underlined and initialed)

5 febrero 1729 un ynfante yndio Joseph Policarpo hijo de la Yglesia,
fueron padrinos Joseph Hernanz y Juana Regina

24 Abril 1729 una ynfanta loba Francisca Paulina hija legitima de
Raimundo Manrrique y Maria Garsia, fueron padrinos Juan de Aguado y
Francisca de San Joseph

4 Marzo 1730 un ynfante yndio Juan Faustino hijo de la Yglesia, fueron
padrinos Manuel de Sarabedra y Chathalina Garsia

*12 Abril 1730 una ynfanta yndia hija legitima de Juan de Dios Quiros
y Dominga Benansia, por nombre Maria de los Dolores, fueron padrinos
Francisco Caietano y Juana Bentura

Una ynfanta yndia Cathalina hija legitima de Yngno de Santiago y
Antonia de la Cruz, padrino Francisco Maldonado Zapata 15 Junio 1729

image filename 4340118_287.jpg

26 Jun 1729 infanta india Maria Florentina hija legitima de Antonio
Ferrel y Mathiana Garcia fueron padrinos Joseph Caietano Serrano

29 Sep 1729 Cornelio hijo legitimo de Francisco Phelipe y María Ygnes
fueron padrinos Joseph Antonio de la Peña y Juana Bentura hazienda San
Blas del Pavellon

Memoria de los Baptismos de esta hacienda del Pabellon

Oy 3 de henero 1728 baptice María Chatarina hija legitima de Juan
Baptista y Francisca Petrona fueron padrinos Miguel de Santiago y
Francisca Petrona indos naturalez del Pueblo de Guejotitan

Oy 3 de febrero 1728 Michaela Susana hija de Maria Antonia Rubia,
soltera, madrina Maria Pasqualas

Oy 5 de febrero 1728 Manuela hija legitima de de Antonio Joseph
Narbaez y Gregoria Quiteria fueron padrinos Ygnacio de Santiago y
Juliana de la Cruz, indos naturalez del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia

*Oy 7 Feb 1728 Juana Maria hija legitima de San (Juan) de la Escaleras
y Nicolasa Rodriguez fueron padrinos Phelis Rodriguez y Lorensa Lopes
sirbientes en esta hacienda

+Oy 16 Feb 1728 Baltasara hija legitima de Domingo de Zalasar y Biaña
de los Reyes fueron padrinos Po Antonio y Tomasa Thadea indos
naturalez y sirbientes de esta hacienda

image filename 4340118_288.jpg

9 Mar 1728 Maria de los Dolores hija legitima de Gaspar de Eredia y
Theresa mulatos fueron padrinos Juan de Yamaz y Maria Flores, todos
sirbientes de esta hacienda

+11 Mar 1728 Tomasa de Aguño padres no conosidos fueron padrinos
Manuel Ramires y Juana Martinez, sirbientes de esta hacienda

12 Mar 1728 Po Emiterio Seledonio hijo legitimo de Efigenia Gregoria
Fernanda y Mal? Lopes, sirbientes en esta hacienda fueron padrinos
Juan Lasaro de la Mota y Juana Antonia

1 Abr 1728 Patricio ijo de Maria Efigenia fueron padrinos Mal? Lopez y
Efigenia He?_, todos sirbientes de esta hacienda

Marzo 11 de 1731
Basilia Getrudis mestiza hija legitima de Bizercio
Basques y Cresencia Jetrudis fueron padrinos Xptoval Javiel y Nicolasa
Eusevia ... y la dicho en onse de Marzo de milsetecientos treintaiuno
en esta ___da del Pavellon

Francisco Paulín lovo hijo legitimo de Francisco Xavier y Maria de la
Candelaria fueron padrinos Juan Lopez y Catalina de la Cruz ... en
quince de Abril 1731 en esta Hazda del Pavellon

Maria Josepha india hija legitima de Salvador Manuel y Francisca de la
Cruz fueron padrinos Rafael Manrrique y Getrudis Figenia Serrano en la
Hacienda de San Blas del Pavellon en beinte y nueve de Abril 1731

image filename 4340118_289.jpg

Prudencia Francisca mestiza hija legitima de Thomas Basquez y Nicolasa
Zervantes madrina Francisca de Estrada ... en esta Hacienda del
Pavellon en seis dias del mes de Maio 1731

Isidora de Jesus india hija legitima de Joseph Antonio y Ma

Look at these baptisms in San Miguel del Alto. They all have a father Manuel GAMA or GAMES and a mother Felipa NERIS, RAMIRES or RAMOS (probably all the same couple):

REFUGO. GAMA NERIS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 08 JUN 1835 San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco, Mexico
MA. GERONIMA GAMES RAMIRES - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 07 OCT 1832 San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco, Mexico
MARIA DE LA SUNCION GAMA RAMOS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 28 MAY 1826 San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco, Mexico

Rosie:

Apparently you have already found the marriage record for your grandparents in the IGI on familysearch.org:

YSABEL GAMA
Marriages:
Spouse: RAMONA MUNOS Family
Marriage: 01 JUN 1879 San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco, Mexico
Batch No.: M603304 Film No. 0279454

That record should list the names of Ysabel's parents as well as his age which will provide valuable information. You should go to a family history center and order the film or write the Family History Library in Salt Lake City and request a printout of the particular record.

Rosie:

In the GEDCOM database, when you find a record, right next to the individual or family number is the name of the tree the record belongs to. You will notice that the record you found is in Linda Castanon-Long's tree, as she mentions in her response.

Given that Linda's Felipa was born in 1830 and you are saying that your great grandmother was married in 1830, these two women cannot be the same person. Or am I misunderstanding your information?

The genealogy that you have posted in your file folder does not have any dates or place names for Felipa so it is difficult to follow.

Have you tried searching for the marriages and births of the people whose names you have using the Films tab of the website? If you know the towns where they came from you can do searches by IGI or VRI batch where you can enter minimal information, i.e. just surnames of parents and see if there are any matches.

Hi Rosie, the file is either Daniel or me since we are family.  I have my records posted on Rootsweb.com and it might be easier for you to read them there.  I don't have a spouse for Maria Felipa and we are not directly related.. Someone in her family married someone in my family.
 
I would suggest you print this if you are not familiar with Rootsweb.com
 
You can find her ancestors by going to Family tree in the tool bar at the top of the page, click on it.
 
Where it says "jump to a specific data base" put in Mexico
 
this will give you my index, put in Ramirez and then it will give you "advanced search" put in Ramirez, Maria Felipa 1830 and she will appear.
 
Click on her name then click on "Pedigree" then click on "display pedigree in text form"
 
Click on any name and it will give you whatever source information I have.
 
This will give you all the information I have on this family line.  Daniel may have taken it back too since I see there is Ornelas and Campos de Anda in her line.
 
I don't know if this is your line or not but wish you luck in your search.
 
Linda in Everett

--- On Wed, 6/3/09, rcordovamba@aol.com wrote:

From: rcordovamba@aol.com
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Felipa Ramirez - need help how to search
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Wednesday, June 3, 2009, 3:07 AM

Sigue version en espanol.
I was searching nuestros ranchos and found a possible match for one of my great grandmothers, Felipa Ramirez a. 1830. She married Manuel Gama a. 1830 and had at least one child, Jose Ysabel Gama who married Ramona Munos on June 1, 1879 in San Miguel El Alto, Jal.

I searched th GEDCOM tab of nuestros ranchos and found Maria Felipa Ramires Brambila christened Feb 8, 1830 in Tamazula. She was one of at least five children of Jose Maria Epifanio Ramirez b. March 23, 1806 and Paula Maria Emigdia Brambila b. June 8, 1814. The family ID is F5918.

I am not familiar with how to try to find more information within nuestros ranchos. How could I find more information to see if the descendents of Felipa Ramires, if any. Whose tree is this? I would appreciate any ideas.

Encontre en nuestros ranchos el nombre de una persona que puede ser una de mis tatarabuelas, Felipa Ramirez a. 1830. Ella se caso con Manuel Gama a. 1830 y tuvieron al menos un hijo, Jose Ysabel Gama quien se caso con Ramona Munos el 1o de junio de 1879 en San Miguel el Alto, Jal.
Busque en GEDCOM de nuestros ranchos y encontre a Maria Felipa Remires Brambila bautizada el 8 de febrero de 1830 en Tamazula. Es una de por lo menos cinco hijos de Jose Maria Epifanio Ramirez b. 03/23/1806 y de Paula Maria Emigdia Brambila b. 06/08/1814. El numero de identificacion de la familia es F5918.
No conosco como tratar de encontrar mas informacion en nuestros ranchos. Como podria encontrar mas informacion para ver los descendientes de Felipa Ramires, si los tuvo. De quien es este arbol? Agradeceria sus sugerencias.
Rosie Cordova