Historical Weather Records, Mexico

Joseph:

I don't know what types of weather records might be available for Mexico, especially for the year you specified - 1793. However, it seems to me that military reports for that time period would include weather reports. I don't know where such military reports would be archived, but my guess would be that they are in the national archive of Mexico in DF or in Spain.

Comentarios

Comentario

Addendum:
I googled: WEATHER RECORDS MEXICO

Sorry to have left that notation out of message --- that's what happens when one does not proof-read one's messages ... : 0

ncc in VA

NARA Genealogy Fair - A report

Just a quick note/report on the NARA Genealogy Fair I attended on Wed., Apr 11, at National Archives in Washington, DC.

The theme for the fair: "Buried Biography: Bring 'Em Back to Life" ; this fair focused on Federal records located @ NARA that relate to genealogy, and that CANNOT be researched online (which means one must go to NARA/DC or other NARA facility). If you haven't visited the NARA genealogy site, I recommend doing so - LOTS of good stuff there; this is the URL:

Comentarios

Comentario

do you know if there are historical weather records for Mexico and how
far back they go. I'd love to know the weather for a couple of select
dates for Sombrerete and Colotlan in 1793.

thanks,

joseph

====================

Joseph Puentes
http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)

nc_coleman wrote:
>
> One of the interesting lectures was called "Stormy Weather" - a discussion of how weather effects families, communities, and local economies. Did severe or cataclysmic weather conditions cause families to move from one place to another, etc. (Note: this lecture was a "maiden" lecture - never before presented; we were the guinea pigs for the speakers - but I thought it was a very interesting topic, and provided food for thought. Samples of types of federal records were: 1) Annual Reports of the Surveyors General; 2) federal annual reports of violent ... weather; 3) records of: the Weather Bureau; WPA; Dept of State (there was a brief discussion of the world-wide effcts of the eruption of the volcano Kracatoa [?sp]); 4) photograph collection.
>
>
> Have a good day.
> Natalie in VA
>
>
>
>
>

Comentario

Wikipedia has a brief history of the " Servicio Meteorologico Nacional"
which began in 1877...

John Gonzalez
Wildomar, CA.

========================================================================================================

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joseph Puentes"
To:
Sent: Friday, April 13, 2007 6:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] NARA Genealogy Fair - A report

> do you know if there are historical weather records for Mexico and how
> far back they go. I'd love to know the weather for a couple of select
> dates for Sombrerete and Colotlan in 1793.
>
> thanks,
>
> joseph
>

Fwd: Suniga -Luna

agustin mota wrote: Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 20:21:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: agustin mota
Subject: Suniga -Luna
To:

I am looking for my lost family can you help? The only information i have is oral history. My grandfathers name was Asencion Luna Haro born around 1892 in Cuculiten Jalisco. My great grandfathers name was Crespin Luna he married Severiana Haro both i believe from the same area.my grandmothers name was Clemencia Suniga born around 1910, married at age 13 died at about age20. after there marrige nothing was ever herd about the Suniga elders. My great grandfathers name was Pedro Suniga i was told came from the Tepetongo area.I was told years ago and recently that there had been a fire in Momax and that these records were lost. My aunts have birth certificates but they provided the information so that the certificate could be made.I know this for a fact.So any information will help get started.I am also reaserching Mota,Herrera,Alvares all from the Momax area these names are

Comentarios

Comentario

Joseph/Agustin:

Coculiten is in present days part of the municipality of Momax, Zacatecas, right on the border with Colotlan, Jalisco. Before a seperate parrish was set up in Momax, baptisms from this town were performed in Tlaltenango.

That being said, Agustin, you are right that many of the registro civil records for Momax are missing... i.e. only the following records are filmed by the FHL:

Nacimientos 1876-1882, 1912-1913 -- Matrimonios 1875-1877, 1879-1880, 1885-1887, 1912-1915 -- Defunciones 1871-1876, 1878-1886, 1912

VAULT INTL Film 2245129 Items 1 - 8

However, the church records are a bit more promising, in particular all of the baptisms for the years in question exist:

Bautismos 1878-1892 FHL INTL Film 443991
Bautismos 1892-1905 FHL INTL Film 443992

as well as the marriage films, though you will have to sift through informacion matrimonial:

Información matrimonial 1874-1877 FHL INTL Film 444000
Información matrimonial 1879-1886 VAULT INTL Film 444001
Información matrimonial 1886-1894 FHL INTL Film 444002
Información matrimonial 1894-1901 FHL INTL Film 444003

Many of the Momax films are indexed and can be searched online:

http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/films/Zacatecas/2030

Comentario

Might your Francisca Herrera de Luna's parents be called Ramon Herrera and
Maria Felipa De Luna. Family search data says Francisca was born in Santo
Tomas, Momax.

I am interested in both surnames, as I believe that people from Tlaltenango
and Momax travelled to and from frequently. My family is from Tlaltenango.

Esperanza
Chicagoland area

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Comentario

Yes you are corect Ramon Herrera and Maria Felipa De Luna were maried in 1829 acording to the LDS information. This part of my family is from Los Aguajes and Coculiten.Some other surnames Haro,Alvares, Raigosa and Marques.If you are from Chicago there is a large concentration of family from this region. My problem is not having recent history so that I can research my families past, on the Luna and Zuniga side. Thanx again and good luck with your search. Agustin

Latina1955@aol.com wrote: Might your Francisca Herrera de Luna's parents be called Ramon Herrera and
Maria Felipa De Luna. Family search data says Francisca was born in Santo
Tomas, Momax.

I am interested in both surnames, as I believe that people from Tlaltenango
and Momax travelled to and from frequently. My family is from Tlaltenango.

Esperanza
Chicagoland area

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Comentario

here a marginally good map:

http://www.usgenealogy.net/members/joseph27703/images/goodtepechitlan_c…

arturoramos wrote:
> Joseph/Agustin:
>
> Coculiten is in present days part of the municipality of Momax, Zacatecas, right on the border with Colotlan, Jalisco. Before a seperate parrish was set up in Momax, baptisms from this town were performed in Tlaltenango.
>
> That being said, Agustin, you are right that many of the registro civil records for Momax are missing... i.e. only the following records are filmed by the FHL:
>
> Nacimientos 1876-1882, 1912-1913 -- Matrimonios 1875-1877, 1879-1880, 1885-1887, 1912-1915 -- Defunciones 1871-1876, 1878-1886, 1912
>
> VAULT INTL Film 2245129 Items 1 - 8
>
> However, the church records are a bit more promising, in particular all of the baptisms for the years in question exist:
>
> Bautismos 1878-1892 FHL INTL Film 443991
> Bautismos 1892-1905 FHL INTL Film 443992
>
> as well as the marriage films, though you will have to sift through informacion matrimonial:
>
> Información matrimonial 1874-1877 FHL INTL Film 444000
> Información matrimonial 1879-1886 VAULT INTL Film 444001
> Información matrimonial 1886-1894 FHL INTL Film 444002
> Información matrimonial 1894-1901 FHL INTL Film 444003
>
> Many of the Momax films are indexed and can be searched online:
>
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/films/Zacatecas/2030

Comentario

this has been a confusion to me. In Jalisco and in Zacatecas I have seen
on maps a Coculitlen/Coculiten and then a Cuculiten/Cuculitlen (not sure
if the "tlen" is correct on either). Anyway I know that there was a
Cuculitlen in Zacatecas and those records are sometimes found in the
Tlaltenango films. Go to www.familysearch.org and find your local Family
History Center, pay them a visit and order some film:

Title
*Registros parroquiales, 1630-1961*

Authors
*Iglesia Católica (Tlaltenango de Sánchez Román, Zacatecas) (Main Author)*

Notes
*Microfilm de manuscritos en Tlaltenango de Sánchez Román.
Catholic church parish registers of baptisms, confirmations, marriages
and deaths from Tlaltenango de Sánchez Román, Zacatecas, Mexico.
Text in Spanish.*

Subjects
* México, Zacatecas, Tlaltenango de Sánchez Román - Church records*

Format
* Manuscript (On Film)*

Language
* Spanish*

Publication
* Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmados por The Genealogical Society of Utah,
1961-1978*

Physical
* 177 rollos de microfilm ; 35 mm., 16 mm.*

Film Notes
Note - Location [Film]
*
Bautismos 1884-1890 - FHL INTL Film [ 443824 ]
Bautismos 1890-1895 - FHL INTL Film [ 443825 ]
Bautismos 1895-1901 - FHL INTL Film [ 443826 ]*

If indeed you are looking for Momax films then here are some possible
films to order:

Title
*Registros parroquiales, 1776-1961*

Authors
*Iglesia Católica (Momax, Zacatecas) (Main Author)*

Notes
*Microfilm de manuscritos en Momax.
Algunos tomos incluyen índice.
Los registros de esta parroquia de Momax incluyen varios lugares de los
municipios de Tlaltenango de Sánchez Román en Zacatecas y Colotlán en
Jalisco.
Parish registers of baptisms, confirmations, marriages and deaths from
Momax, Zacatecas, Mexico.*

Subjects
* México, Zacatecas, Momax - Church records
México, Jalisco, Refugio - Church records*

Format
* Manuscript (On Film)*

Language
* Spanish*

Publication
* Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmado por la Sociedad Genealógica de Utah, 1962*

Physical
* 37 rollos de microfilm ; 35 mm.*

Film Notes
Note - Location [Film]
*Bautismos 1776-1811 - FHL INTL Film [ 443987 ]
Bautismos 1811-1829 - FHL INTL Film [ 443988 ]
Bautismos 1829-1850 - FHL INTL Film [ 443989 ]
Bautismos 1850-1878 - FHL INTL Film [ 443990 ]
Bautismos 1878-1892 - FHL INTL Film [ 443991 ]
Bautismos 1892-1905 - FHL INTL Film [ 443992 ]
Bautismos 1905-1919 - FHL INTL Film [ 443993 ]

if you are looking in the Tepetongo area then here are films to order:

*

Title
*Registros parroquiales, 1750-1972*

Authors
*Iglesia Católica. San Juan Bautista (Tepetongo, Zacatecas) (Main Author)*

Notes
*Microfilme de manuscritos en los archivos de la parroquia y del
Obispado de Zacatecas.
Algunos de los libros incluyen índice.
Parish registers of baptisms, confirmations, marriage petitions and
marriages, and deaths from Tepetongo, Zacatecas, Mexico.*

Subjects
* México, Zacatecas, Tepetongo - Church records*

Format
* Manuscript (On Film)*

Language
* Spanish*

Publication
* Salt Lake City, Utah : Filmados por la Sociedad Genealógica de Utah,
1978, 1988*

Physical
* 51 rollos de microfilme ; 35 mm., 16 mm.*

Film Notes
Note - Location [Film]
*Bautismos 1750-1770, 1775-1780, 1786-1808, 1812-1817 - FHL INTL Film [
1158146 ]
Bautismos 1818-1831 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158147 ]
Bautismos 1831-1847 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158148 ]
Bautismos 1847-1858 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158149 ]
Bautismos 1859, 1862-1870 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158150 ]
Bautismos 1871-1881 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158151 ]
Bautismos 1881-1891 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158152 ]
Bautismos 1891-1907 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158153 ]
Bautismos 1907-1916 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158154 ]
Bautismos 1916-1932 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158155 ]
Bautismos 1932-1937 - FHL INTL Film [ 1158156 ]
Bautismos de hijos naturales 1843-1860,1862-1919 - FHL INTL Film [
1158157 ]

*agustin mota wrote:
> agustin mota wrote: Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 20:21:37 -0700 (PDT)
> From: agustin mota
> Subject: Suniga -Luna
> To:
>
> I am looking for my lost family can you help? The only information i have is oral history. My grandfathers name was Asencion Luna Haro born around 1892 in Cuculiten Jalisco. My great grandfathers name was Crespin Luna he married Severiana Haro both i believe from the same area.my grandmothers name was Clemencia Suniga born around 1910, married at age 13 died at about age20. after there marrige nothing was ever herd about the Suniga elders. My great grandfathers name was Pedro Suniga i was told came from the Tepetongo area.I was told years ago and recently that there had been a fire in Momax and that these records were lost. My aunts have birth certificates but they provided the information so that the certificate could be made.I know this for a fact.So any information will help get started.I am also reaserching Mota,Herrera,Alvares all from the Momax area these names are progresing due to other records.Thank you all Agustin from northern Sonoma county.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time
> with theYahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Don't pick lemons.
> See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

Comentario

Agustin from northern Sonoma county,

Will you please list the Mota and Herrera individulas that you are researching from Momax?
Is the Suniga surname the same as Zuniga?

Thank You,
Pat Silva Corbera

Comentario

Patricia Corbera wrote: Agustin from northern Sonoma county,

Will you please list the Mota and Herrera individulas that you are researching from Momax?
Is the Suniga surname the same as Zuniga?

Thank You,
Pat Silva C
Pat here are some of the names I am researching, my grandfather Vicente Mota Raigosa born 1-9-1897 His first wife Nicolasa Alvares. Los Aguajes Jalisco. Mygreat grandfather, Agustin Mota Herrera born8-281862 Coculiten Jalisco. His wife was Guillerma Raigosa. My great great grandfather Vicente Mota born 4-20-1853 His wife was Francisca Herrera de Luna born abt1846. And yes the corect spelling is Zuniga. Thank you for your intrest Agustin.

---------------------------------
The fish are biting.
Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.

Comentario

Agustin,

Thank you... Good luck with your research!

Pat Silva Corbera
----- Original Message -----
From: "agustin mota"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 9:00 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] : Suniga -Luna

>
>
> Patricia Corbera wrote: Agustin from northern
> Sonoma county,
>
> Will you please list the Mota and Herrera individulas that you are
> researching from Momax?
> Is the Suniga surname the same as Zuniga?
>
> Thank You,
> Pat Silva C
> Pat here are some of the names I am researching, my grandfather Vicente
> Mota Raigosa born 1-9-1897 His first wife Nicolasa Alvares. Los Aguajes
> Jalisco. Mygreat grandfather, Agustin Mota Herrera born8-281862 Coculiten
> Jalisco. His wife was Guillerma Raigosa. My great great grandfather
> Vicente Mota born 4-20-1853 His wife was Francisca Herrera de Luna born
> abt1846. And yes the corect spelling is Zuniga. Thank you for your intrest
> Agustin.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> The fish are biting.
> Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing.

National Genealogy Society's conference

A quick question.

Is anyone from the group, going to the NGS's conference in Richmond, next week?

Jonathan

Comentarios

Comentario

Jonathan:

The conference is not until the 15th of May so it is a bit more than a month away. I just went on the website and saw some interesting seminars, etc. I am now considering going for a day since I don't think I can take more than that off work and since it is only a few hours from Washington DC.

For anyone interested, below is the website:

http://www.eshow2000.com/ngs/2007/

There is nothing Mexican or Hispanic/Latin themed at all but some of the more technical seminars on standard of proof, technology, etc. seem very useful.

Teocuitlan de Corona, Jalisco

Is anyone else searching this area? I might of found some of my ancestors from this place. Here is the following information from IGI.

Jose Norverto de la Cueba and Maria Salome Gonzales
Marriage: May 15, 1787

Hurtado and Santiago in Los Haros, Zacatecas

For Raul Fernandez, I just noticed I have some records for what I think are your lines in Los Haros. I have records I haven't entered in to my files yet but if you go to Rootsweb and put in Matilde (Maria) Santiago birth date 1872 it will pull up the family and the records I have on that line. I don't have the ancestor that connects you but I do have 3 children for them as well as some ancestors, hope it's your line and of some help to you.

Comentarios

Comentario

Hi Linda, I just send you a privete email . I have no idea why it was in the refuse place. But I also notice that I can't log on or maybe I don't know how. I would like to add to my family tree for all to see but I can.
Have a nice weekend all.

Mary

Una Nochistlense

Loulou,

Will you be going to this event? Or for that matter will anyone else who's from that region be going to this celebration in April? I don't know if I can but it sounds like it would be a nice opportunity to meet up with people from our region.

Comentarios

Comentario

Alicia,
I was planning on going with all my cousins who live
in LA, but it turns out my niece is doing her
confirmation that same weekend in Benicia. I really
hate to miss out. Sounds like fun. Oh well, maybe next
year.

Let me know if you decide to go.

Loulou

--- Alicia Carrillo wrote:

> Loulou,
>
> Will you be going to this event? Or for that matter
> will anyone else who's from that region be going to
> this celebration in April? I don't know if I can but
> it sounds like it would be a nice opportunity to
> meet up with people from our region.
>
> Thanks Loulou for posting this!!
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Loulou_R
> To: announce@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2007 2:39:53 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Sèptimo Aniversario del
> Día de Nochistlense
>
>
> Just wanted to pass along the following
> announcement:
>
> La Asociación de Clubes Nochistlenses los invita a
> celebrar el día del Nochistlense los días 28 y 29 de
> Abril del presente año.
>
> http://nochistlenses.org/eventos.html
>

Comentario

i will be going.

Alicia Carrillo wrote: Loulou,

Will you be going to this event? Or for that matter will anyone else who's from that region be going to this celebration in April? I don't know if I can but it sounds like it would be a nice opportunity to meet up with people from our region.

Thanks Loulou for posting this!!

Alicia,
San Jose, Calif

----- Original Message ----
From: Loulou_R
To: announce@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2007 2:39:53 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Sèptimo Aniversario del Día de Nochistlense

Just wanted to pass along the following announcement:

La Asociación de Clubes Nochistlenses los invita a celebrar el día del Nochistlense los días 28 y 29 de Abril del presente año.

http://nochistlenses.org/eventos.html

Mary,

Thanks, I was able to see the American Heritage this time.
Mary

-----Original Message-----
>From: Edward Serros
>Sent: Apr 1, 2007 9:41 PM
>To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Mary,

Comentarios

Comentario

Mary Gervassi

I am so sorry, I did not introduce myself. I starded getting help so fast from Ed and Jonathan.

I have been doing resarch for about 10 and maybe more years. But I ran into a little problem and I starded to resarch and get help. Well I did get it and I got so excided that I forgot to introduce my self.
My resarch is in Panuco, Zacatecas, Tamazula, Jalisco and Zapoltitic as well.
With the information that I got so quick I was able to order films from Panuco, which I couldn't find before.
Thanks guys you are gggggreat!!

Comentario

Mary we made contact long ago looking for mutual family from Tamazula and Zapotiltic. I've checked the files but didn't see yours.. has it been submitted yet? I have put my records into the files here but also up dated them on Rootsweb and Ancestry.com.. I like Rootsweb better! Hoping we can still find those illusive ancestors that make us extended family.
Welcome again, Linda in Everett

Linda Castanon-Long

Comentario

Hi Linda, fancy metting you here. I stoped doing geneology for awaile but I had an accident at work and was in the hospital for about a month got home around the end of January and as day's went by I was getting very bored.
Well to make it short, I'm back looking for my Mitre's from Panuco, Zacatecas. Boy! are these people hard to find. I just ordered 2 films from the LDS and don't expect them in until about a month. Somthing about they are behind, that's making them send films late.

Nice talking to you
Mary

Comentario

Mary can you tell me again the lines you're working from Tamazula and Zapotiltic? I'm going to be working on some of those records shortly and if you have any specific names or dates just let me know and I will watch for them. I'm afraid my Zacatecas lines are from Jerez and nothing from the Panuco area.
Hope you're feeling better now,

Linda in Everett

mgervassi wrote:

Hi Linda, fancy metting you here. I stoped doing geneology for awaile but I had an accident at work and was in the hospital for about a month got home around the end of January and as day's went by I was getting very bored.
Well to make it short, I'm back looking for my Mitre's from Panuco, Zacatecas. Boy! are these people hard to find. I just ordered 2 films from the LDS and don't expect them in until about a month. Somthing about they are behind, that's making them send films late.

Nice talking to you
Mary

Comentario

Linda
My resarch in Tamazula and Zapoltiic are from my Sanchez line. I could invite you it if you like. Just let me know. But send me an email privetly so that I can get your email address.

Mary

Crpto-Jews

I recommend the following books:

Dogs of God : Columbus, the Inquisition, and the defeat of the Moors / James
Reston, Jr., New York : Doubleday : c2005.

"To The End Of The Earth : A History Of The Crypto-Jews Of New Mexico" by

Onates in Zacatecas

Hello Ed,
My mother's maiden name is Onate, and she is reported to have been born in either Villa Garcia, Zacatecas or Aguascalientes, Ags. I say reported because she had no birth certificate, grew up believing she was from Aguascalientes until she met her aunt Leonarda Onate who told her otherwise. Tia also took us to meet her brother Adolfo Onate living at the time (1960's)in Guadalajara. I have not been able to verify through FHC where she was born. My grandfather was Luis Onate and my ggrandfather was Don Rosalio De Onate. I was also taken to Don Rosalio's tomb inside a church in Aguascalientes. Unfortunately, I was about 12 at the time and not much interested. My mother's oral family history sounds like a gothic novel. Ironically, the only records I have found are from Panuco, Zacatecas 1882 on the marriage of my maternal grandmother--Santelices. I'm aware of the Onate history you so kindly made available; it's much more recent past that's got me stumped! Alice

portguese naming practices There are others

Ed,

Read your wondering about dual names with regards to the Jewish persons and their possibility of dual names. I have to say to those who were brave enough to practiced openly may not have, but those who were the converso basically had two lives and with that two or more names. Depending on their social status and the jobs closest to the crown made the true identity all the more important to hide.

Of Crypto-Jews/Moriscos in the New World

The discussion on crypto jews in the New World had me googling around for more information on Jews and Muslims in the New World recently. I was intrigued by someone's mention of their grandmother being a "mesquita", supposedly meaning "mosque" so I took that to refer to Muslims in the New World, since Muslims go to "mosques" and Jews go to their "temples".

Panuco, Zacatecas

I would like to know if someone is doing resarch in Panuco, Zacatecas. I would also like a map of Zacatecas, can anyone help me with getting one??

I am doing resarch for my g--grandmother, her name is Manuela Mitre and her father is Maroial Mitre her mother is Juana Sandoval and they are from Panuco, Zacatecas. It seems that her father got married more than once and I am having a hard time to know which is which.

Comentarios

Comentario

Mary,

If you want a old map of Zacatecas, I suggest going to www.davidrumsey.com .
They have 2 Maps of Zacatecas , One from 1827 and the other from 1858. Also, I can email you a map of Zacatecas (but it is 5 meg in size).

Jonathan

Comentario

Mary,

What type of a map, are you looking for?

Jonathan

--------- Original Message --------
From: research@nuestrosranchos.org
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
Date: 04/01/07 09:40

> I would like to know if someone is doing resarch in Panuco, Zacatecas. I
would also like a map of Zacatecas, can anyone help me with getting one??
>
> I am doing resarch for my g--grandmother, her name is Manuela Mitre and
her father is Maroial Mitre her mother is Juana Sandoval and they are from
Panuco, Zacatecas. It seems that her father got married more than once and
I am having a hard time to know which is which.
> There is to many Manuel's in that area. I found a Manuel Garcia getting
married to a Manuela Mitre, but I don't think that is the one. She is 15
years old when she married and if I am not mistaken she got married in
1869. My Manuela Mitre had a child in 1861.
>
> I also ran into a Robert Mite from Colorado.and his g--grandfather's name
is Tiburcio Mitre and his wife was Refo Diaz. This was the begning of my
confusion. When I did a resarch I found out that both g-g-grandfathers
have the same name, but different wifes.
>
> Monday I will be ordering 2 film from the LDS. One for Birth and one for
Marriages. Maybe I can solve this problem.
>
> Mary
>
>
> mgervassi@earthlink.net
> EarthLink Revolves Around You.

Comentario

One that might have Panuco Zacatecas in it. But I will settle for Santo Domingo. It will have be an old mape of Zacatecas, if it can be found. Got any clues??

Mary

-----Original Message-----
>From: Jonathan
>Sent: Apr 1, 2007 3:01 PM
>To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
>
>Mary,
>
>What type of a map, are you looking for?
>
>Jonathan
>
>--------- Original Message --------
>From: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
>Date: 04/01/07 09:40
>
>> I would like to know if someone is doing resarch in Panuco, Zacatecas. I
>would also like a map of Zacatecas, can anyone help me with getting one??
>>
>> I am doing resarch for my g--grandmother, her name is Manuela Mitre and
>her father is Maroial Mitre her mother is Juana Sandoval and they are from
>Panuco, Zacatecas. It seems that her father got married more than once and
>I am having a hard time to know which is which.

Comentario

Mary,

Via personal email, you asked me more about Pánuco and I must comment on the Oñate family.

The Oñate family has everything to do with Pánuco, originally a great silver-producing pueblo. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crist%C3%B3bal_de_O%C3%B1ate for a summary of the Oñate family activities in Pánuco. Don Juan de Oñate “discovered” and named El Paso, Texas. More Don Juan, see http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/online/articles/OO/upo2_print.html.

If you prefer Spanish, see http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_de_O%C3%B1ate for Don Juan de Oñate.

As is the case of many great mining cities, once the mines become depleted the inhabitants leave, hence a pueblo fantasma, which fairly much describes Pánuco today given descriptions I have had of the place presently and also conversations with people from Zacatecas.

I was in Zacatecas, Zacatecas two years ago and I unforgivably did not visit the town, or at least what is left of it. It is the part of the El Camino Real de Tierra Adentro, see http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/2004/2/2004_2_44.s…, which starts off with a discussion of Pánuco. The latter link is a delightful story of a journey on the El Camino Real.

I will also post this on the Ranchos site. For what it is worth, many of the Cerros (or Cerro or de Cerro or de Serro) are originally from Pánuco, or so it is said. There is a part of Páncuo called Casa de Cerro. I have not made any connections with my family and anybody in Pánuco, as of yet.

Ed Serros

Comentario

Ed, thanks so much for the article about the Camino Real. My mother was a Native of New Mexico, and I have driven that stretch from Northern New Mexico down to Las Cruces, El Paso and Juarez many times. How I wish I could follow that trail into Mexico, but the American Heritage article you sent made me feel like I had been across the border. My mothers Spanish ancestors, the Marquez, were with Onate in 1598, as were my father's Olague ancestors. The Marquez stayed to settle in NM, but my father's high-tailed it back to Zacatecas as soon as they could get away from Onate. He was a ruthless man, but I guess they had to be.

The link for wikipedia you gave didn't work, but this one does;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_de_Onate

Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA ----
----- Original Message -----
From: Edward Serros
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 9:41 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Mary,

Mary,

Via personal email, you asked me more about Pánuco and I must comment on the Oñate family.

The Oñate family has everything to do with Pánuco, originally a great silver-producing pueblo. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crist%C3%B3bal_de_O%C3%B1ate for a summary of the Oñate family activities in Pánuco. Don Juan de Oñate “discovered” and named El Paso, Texas. More Don Juan, see http://www.tsha.utexas.edu/handbook/online/articles/OO/upo2_print.html.

If you prefer Spanish, see http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juan_de_O%C3%B1ate for Don Juan de Oñate.

As is the case of many great mining cities, once the mines become depleted the inhabitants leave, hence a pueblo fantasma, which fairly much describes Pánuco today given descriptions I have had of the place presently and also conversations with people from Zacatecas.

I was in Zacatecas, Zacatecas two years ago and I unforgivably did not visit the town, or at least what is left of it. It is the part of the El Camino Real de Tierra Adentro, see http://www.americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/2004/2/2004_2_44.s…, which starts off with a discussion of Pánuco. The latter link is a delightful story of a journey on the El Camino Real.

I will also post this on the Ranchos site. For what it is worth, many of the Cerros (or Cerro or de Cerro or de Serro) are originally from Pánuco, or so it is said. There is a part of Páncuo called Casa de Cerro. I have not made any connections with my family and anybody in Pánuco, as of yet.

Ed Serros

research Digest, Vol 15, Issue 1

...Mary, here is a link to many different maps & areas of Zacatecas. This map link can be used for ALL areas in Mexico and other countries as well. I hope this helps ya out some. Until the next time, good luck with your research...

Comentarios

Comentario

...I forgot to tell ya, that if ya move your mouse over the different areas, it will list all ranchos, towns & cities within that map. It's pretty cool.. :-))

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Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
DAILY DIGEST
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Today's Topics:

1. Panuco, Zacatecas (mgervassi@earthlink.net)
2. Re: Panuco, Zacatecas (Jonathan)
3. Re: Panuco, Zacatecas (Mary Gervassi)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2007 14:41:28 -0700
From: "mgervassi@earthlink.net"
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Message-ID: <410-2200740121412815@earthlink.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

I would like to know if someone is doing resarch in Panuco, Zacatecas. I would also like a map of Zacatecas, can anyone help me with getting one??

I am doing resarch for my g--grandmother, her name is Manuela Mitre and her father is Maroial Mitre her mother is Juana Sandoval and they are from Panuco, Zacatecas. It seems that her father got married more than once and I am having a hard time to know which is which.
There is to many Manuel's in that area. I found a Manuel Garcia getting married to a Manuela Mitre, but I don't think that is the one. She is 15 years old when she married and if I am not mistaken she got married in 1869. My Manuela Mitre had a child in 1861.

I also ran into a Robert Mite from Colorado.and his g--grandfather's name is Tiburcio Mitre and his wife was Refo Diaz. This was the begning of my confusion. When I did a resarch I found out that both g-g-grandfathers have the same name, but different wifes.

Monday I will be ordering 2 film from the LDS. One for Birth and one for Marriages. Maybe I can solve this problem.

Mary

mgervassi@earthlink.net
EarthLink Revolves Around You.

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2007 16:01:59 -0600
From: Jonathan
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Message-ID: <0193343929396fac3dd6787e60e70fb3@67.166.112.194>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

Mary,

What type of a map, are you looking for?

Jonathan

--------- Original Message --------
From: research@nuestrosranchos.org
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Panuco, Zacatecas
Date: 04/01/07 09:40

> I would like to know if someone is doing resarch in Panuco, Zacatecas. I
would also like a map of Zacatecas, can anyone help me with getting one??
>
> I am doing resarch for my g--grandmother, her name is Manuela Mitre and
her father is Maroial Mitre her mother is Juana Sandoval and they are from
Panuco, Zacatecas. It seems that her father got married more than once and
I am having a hard time to know which is which.
> There is to many Manuel's in that area. I found a Manuel Garcia getting
married to a Manuela Mitre, but I don't think that is the one. She is 15
years old when she married and if I am not mistaken she got married in
1869. My Manuela Mitre had a child in 1861.
>
> I also ran into a Robert Mite from Colorado.and his g--grandfather's name
is Tiburcio Mitre and his wife was Refo Diaz. This was the begning of my
confusion. When I did a resarch I found out that both g-g-grandfathers
have the same name, but different wifes.
>
> Monday I will be ordering 2 film from the LDS. One for Birth and one for
Marriages. Maybe I can solve this problem.
>
> Mary
>
>
> mgervassi@earthlink.net
> EarthLink Revolves Around You.

Portuguese naming practices

I've been reading a book titled OVER THE EDGE OF THE WORLD by Laurence Bergreen, it's the history of Ferdinand Magellan, the Portuguese Navigator or Fernao de Magalhaes who was said to have been born around 1480 in the Parish of Sabrosa in northwestern Portugal. His lineage can be traced through his father Rodrigo de Magalhaes who could trace his heritage back to the 11th century to a French crusader, De Magalhaes. Rodrigo qualified as minor Portuguese nobility.

Comentarios

Comentario

The Portuguese surname practices that you discuss were not unique to the Portuguese. The Spanish in the 1500's and beyond take similar liberty in the use of apellidos. For example, the Santos Coy and the de la Garza Falcon surnames from the Nuevo Leon/Saltillo/Monterey are equally bizarre if you go back to the original paternal and maternal surnames in Spain. Admittedly, these two families had family members in their genealogy tree that were Portuguese and likely Jewish. However, there many other Spanish examples, e.g. Don Juan de Oñate---Basque paternal line and converso maternal line.

I often wonder if the conversos had multiple names (Christian name and Jewish name), thereby making the Christian name less important or not as important. The latter is sheer speculation on my part.

Ed

Comentario

Edward and Linda,

In large part that's what caught my attention knowing that the Portuguese and Españoles probably had more in common than we factually know of. The survival instinct is more powerful than the desire to maintain one's ancestral lineage, unless of course to do so would prove to be advantageous monetarily or to prove linkage to some royal heritage.

Edward , the possibility exists that the Christian name may have been more important than the Jewish one. Taking on the Christian name they could still be Jewish but show to the world through their surname that they were Christian. The Jews rather than leave Portugal overtly displayed their Christianity in order to survive. During the reign of King Manuel 1, in 1496, he asked for the hand in marriage of the daughter of Ferdinand and Isabella, he was told that only under the condition that he purify Portugal of the Jews as the Spanish had done in 1492. King Manuel had a fondness for the Jewish people as they were scholars, artists, scientists and the best educated and rather than expelling them he had them convert to Christianity. However this didn't last because in the early 1500's there were mass slaughterings of Jews and many fled to the Netherlands.

Alicia

----- Original Message ----
From: Edward Serros
To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sunday, April 1, 2007 9:39:41 AM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Portuguese naming practices

The Portuguese surname practices that you discuss were not unique to the Portuguese. The Spanish in the 1500's and beyond take similar liberty in the use of apellidos. For example, the Santos Coy and the de la Garza Falcon surnames from the Nuevo Leon/Saltillo/Monterey are equally bizarre if you go back to the original paternal and maternal surnames in Spain. Admittedly, these two families had family members in their genealogy tree that were Portuguese and likely Jewish. However, there many other Spanish examples, e.g. Don Juan de Oñate---Basque paternal line and converso maternal line.

I often wonder if the conversos had multiple names (Christian name and Jewish name), thereby making the Christian name less important or not as important. The latter is sheer speculation on my part.

Ed

Comentario

Alicia, I'm having the same problem with females choosing to use grandparents surnames in the 1600's in Michoacan Mexico making it really hard to put my Alvarez Del Castillo families in the records correctly. They use grandparents surnames on some records and their mothers surname of others and then there is always that one record with their fathers surname in the mix! If a person was not familiar with what doing genealogy entails they would think we were crazy for putting so many surnames into one persons records.

Every bit of information, like the naming practice's of the Portuguese are important for doing research. I'm wondering if Portuguese scribes in early Mexico had anything to do with this too?

Linda in Everett

Linda Castanon-Long

Nor Cal meeting notes

Hello Natalie,

Thank you for your interest. As Alicia has stated, it was a lively
meeting. I hope one day you can join us. I am about go on vacation, so it
may be a few more weeks before I post the notes to NuestrosRanchos. The

NoCal Genealogy Meeting - will there be a report?

Just curious: How was the meeting of the Northern California Ranchos Group that was held in Sacramento? The agenda looked very interesting. Will you be posting a report?

Natalie in VA

Comentarios

Comentario

Natalie,

I was the note taker and have not had a chance to transcribe my notes and present to our coordinator.

Hopefully I will have time this weekend and will submit them to Maria Cortez and she will forward them to the group. We had an extremely lively meeting with much participation on everyone's part. It's been the largest gathering to date, we were cozy like sardines in the meeting room and the room was pretty spacious.

Alicia

----- Original Message ----
From: nc_coleman
To: announce@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 4:29:58 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] NoCal Genealogy Meeting - will there be a report?

Just curious: How was the meeting of the Northern California Ranchos Group that was held in Sacramento? The agenda looked very interesting. Will you be posting a report?

Natalie in VA

Roots Television

Here's another plug for ROOTS TELEVISION (Jonathan mentioned this in a message in Oct.2006). In addition to the George RYSKAMP lecture on HISPANIC GENEALOGY (in four parts), there are many other presentations on genealogy "how-to", plus all kinds of aids, stories, etc. There is a 3-minute clip of Victor Villasenor where he tells how discovering his roots changed his life, and other clips from the Ancestry series of a few years ago. The programs are listed in alphabetical order, and the Ryskamp lecture is listed as "Hispanic Roots". You could probably watch the programs all day, and it would be like attending a genealogical conference - and, if you were so inclined, you could do so in your pajamas ; )

Comentarios

"El Paso del Norte"

I came across this site and thought I would share with y'all in case you had not yet seen it (the site):

http://www.espinosaproductions.com/development/norte.html

I tried to connect to the museum site, but the URL wasn't any good.

Comentarios

Comentario

Natalie,

Thanks for this info. It is very interesting. I also tried the link to the Immigration Museum, and it doesn't work, perhaps because that museum is still in the planning stage or has been put on the back burner? I did try the "more" link, and I really found all the links very interesting as regards sites about the Southwest and Mexico.

Emilie Garcia
Port Orchard, WA ---
----- Original Message -----
From: nc_coleman
To: announce@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, March 26, 2007 4:57 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] "El Paso del Norte"

I came across this site and thought I would share with y'all in case you had not yet seen it (the site):

http://www.espinosaproductions.com/development/norte.html

I tried to connect to the museum site, but the URL wasn't any good.

Natalie in VA

Genealogy conference

Saturday afternoon:
I have just returned from the annual genealogy conference held by my local/county genealogical society (Fairfax Genealogical Society). Although the research focus for most of the membership is for American and European ancestry, there is always something to gleam regarding research techniques, which are of course, useful for any research. Because we are just outside Washington, DC, many nationally known researchers/authors, etc are often presenters at our conferences (they may be in the area working on research of their own). The out-of-town speakers were Jana Sloan Broglin, George G. Morgan (he does the "Genealogy Guys" podcasts), and Laura G. Prescott. Two other speakers - Linda Jonas (specializing in Colonial America and British genealogy) and Chuck Mason (a frequent contributor to the NGS news magazine) are members of our society. The conference offered 20 presentations, and it was hard to pick just four.

Comentarios

Comentario

What type of Hispanic conferences are you looking for?

There is the annual Texas conference in September, also there is the Legado Latino Conference in Salt Lake in October or November. Also a good place to keep an eye on, is the calender at the "SHHAR" website (aka: Somos Primos).

Jonathan

Hispanic Reasearch Class-Jonathan

Jonathan,
I am interested in joining the class. How do I sign up?
Thanks for the opportunity.

Gilbert Paez

> [Original Message]
> From:
> To:

Comentarios

Comentario

for those who want to take the class, you need to goto the website www.familyhistoryliveonline.com and do 2 things, first of all subscribe and then download the viewer program. Then install the viewer onto your computer.

Then when the class is taught you need to log into the class about 5 to 10 minutes before it starts. Because the class is on a first come first served basis, with a limit (for right now) of about 15 people.

Jonathan

Comentario

I just wanted to let everyone know, I will be teaching my class on Sunday Evenings from 7:15pm to 7:45pm (MST). Starting this coming Sunday. And then I will be doing online support (answering questions) 8pm to 11pm, Sunday evenings. For information, you can e-mail me at jonathan@mexicanfhr.com or you can goto www.familyhistoryliveonline.com

Jonathan

Hispanic Genealogy classes

Jonathan,

How many weeks will these classes last? I really want to attend, but the rehearsal time for the choir I direct is at the same time as your classes. However, our performance is April 29, and then I'll be free till September when Christmas rehearsals start up.

Comentarios