Dr.mt

Los Cuentos de Kiko

Published by makas_nc –
Forums
History, Culture and General Discussion

Our Oral Historian Frank Moreno Sifuentes has another group of Oral
History stories for us. Please have a listen and send your feedback to
Frank at: conzafos@msn.com

http://nuestrafamiliaunida.com/podcast/oral_history.html#kiko

Comments

Published by makas_nc – Wed, 2007-08-22 15:00 | Permalink

Comment

Our Oral Historian Kiko Sifuentes has added many more Cuentos to his
"Cuentos de Kiko" section of the http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com podcast.
Please have a listen:

http://nuestrafamiliaunida.com/podcast/oral_history.html#kiko

===> "ArtOfNicknaming_01" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "ArtOfNicknaming_02" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Calcutta 1973" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Christmas Kiss" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Destino de Mama Grande" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Football Mania" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "La Jefita" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Las Mamas" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Letter to my Jefito" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Lupe Lemos y El Puerquito" part 1 by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Lupe Lemos y El Puerquito" part 2 by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Lupe Lemos y El Puerquito" part 3 by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Lupe Lemos y El Puerquito" part 4 by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Lupe Lemos y El Puerquito" part 5 by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Ormigas Rojas" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Secret Gift" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

===> "Tortilla Lore" by Frank Moreno Sifuentes

Padrinos

Published by oldcar53 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Daniel,

Padrinos could be anyone who was Catholic and who was deemed to be in good standing with the church, thus they could be siblings. Often times the padrinos were not married to each other but usually were in some way related to the parents of the child who was baptised.

Comments

Published by Maureen Bejar – Tue, 2007-08-21 15:56 | Permalink

Comment

Dear Daniel:
I have extracted numerous baptism records from San Miguel, Valle de Guadalupe, Tepatitlan and now Tangancicuaro. Often the padrinos listed in my family lines were married, but this is not always the case. I have found some padrinos that were not married and also who were brother and sister. I have noticed in many of the documents that if the padrinos were brother and sister it will state hermanos. However, I have seen documents were I know the two were brother and sister, but it did not state hermanos. About 96 percent of the time, the padrinos have been somehow related to the parents, but there are exceptions to every rule! Your best bet is to keep accumulating documents that will substantiate your hunch. In this case possibly baptisms or marriages of the parties involved to see if they have the same parents.

Published by Maureen Bejar – Tue, 2007-08-21 16:07 | Permalink

Comment

Dear Daniel:
One other note of caution. In Tangancicuaro it seems that many cousins were named after the grandfather and their brothers or sisters married people with the same family name, sometimes related to each other and sometimes not related. This leads to confusion. Same names and almost the same age. Also remember sons often were named after fathers. Could this person be just someone with the same name, a son, a cousin? Once again more documents from the same general area with uncover if you have a person with the same name married to the woman standing as padrino. You might find baptisms of children born to the padrinos within the same batch of records. You would not believe how many Jose de Jesus Rochas I have seen in Tangancicuaro. So confusing.

Published by oldcar53 – Tue, 2007-08-21 14:00 | Permalink

Comment

Daniel,

Padrinos could be anyone who was Catholic and who was deemed to be in good standing with the church, thus they could be siblings. Often times the padrinos were not married to each other but usually were in some way related to the parents of the child who was baptised.

Alicia,
San Jose, Calif

----- Original Message ----
From: mormonboy74
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2007 1:43:04 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Padrinos

This has been a question to me for a while. Although we are Mormon we still carry the tradition of Padrinoship. for instance mine are my grandfather and his 2nd wife. I have a question. can Padrinos be a brother and sister? Im trying to connect my Angela de Oropesa. In a document, it says "fueron sus padrinos Magdaleno Lopes de Oropesa y Angela Lopes de Oropesa. In our Hacienda any people with the same last name is related. Hence the intermarriage. The Oropesas came to our hacienda around 1890. The ones were named Thomas, Gervacio, Magdaleno and Maria Oropesa. They were said to came after my 3rd grt grandmother came named...Angela de Oropesa who married Jose Maria Hernandez de Solis. And had Eulalia de Solis. Who married Estevan Lopez de Duran who had Lorensa Lopez de Solis who married Celso del Camino y de Soto. Who had Antonio Lopez del Camino who married Maria Guadalupe Vasquez de Elizalde, who had my grandfather Antonio II del Camino. Anyway...The
fact is on a relatives b
aptismal
Magdaleno and Angela Oropesa were padrinos, but she cant be married to him because at the same time he was married to Francisca Garcia de Bedoya. So it has led me to believe that Magdaleno and Angela are siblings. Can anyone help? -Daniel Mendez....d. C.

Cecilia Lopez and Ortiz de San Pedro

Published by hfaizcorbe –
Forums
Genealogy Research

I have a Sebastian de Luna married around 1680 to Josefa Lozano, from Aguascalientes. The only Sebastian de Luna I've found around that time and region is the son of Luis de Luna and Josefa de Haro, or Esquivelm christened in Tlaltenango on 10 February, 1659. Could anyone confirm if he is the one married to Josefa Lozano?

Padrinos

Published by mendezdetorres –
Forums
Genealogy Research

This has been a question to me for a while. Although we are Mormon we still carry the tradition of Padrinoship. for instance mine are my grandfather and his 2nd wife. I have a question. can Padrinos be a brother and sister? Im trying to connect my Angela de Oropesa.

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Tue, 2007-08-21 13:50 | Permalink

Comment

Daniel:

In Mexican Catholic tradition, padrinos need not necessarily be a married couple. They were often, as you mention, siblings, mother and son, brother and sister-in-law, etc. I have run across all sorts of different combinations both in my personal experience and in reading filmed records from centuries ago. When padrinos' relationship is other than husband and wife and it is explained in the record, such information can be as valuable as the information on the person whose record one is reading.

map of ranchos

Published by yotomas –
Forums
Genealogy Research

is there a map that identifies all the ranchos in the Jalisco area here on file

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Tue, 2007-08-21 01:44 | Permalink

Comment

Yolanda:

There are maps in the links section under Digital Map Collections:

http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/13997

You can find contemporary maps (by the Secretaria de Comunicaciones y Transportes) and historical maps. The David Rumsey Collection in particular has beautiful Antonio Garcia Cubas maps from the mid 1800s.

de Lunas

Published by Welester –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Hello there Anna ,

My name is Welester G. Alvarado my Great great Grandfather (Candelario ) was born in Villa de Saltillo in the state of Coahuila his parents were Juan de Alvarado and Maria Pascuala de Luna , Jose Antonio Candelario Alvarado was thier son baptized the 10th of Feb. 1792 . My question is do you think that the Lunas from Tlatenango came up to Coahuila ?

Comments

Published by anaareluna – Mon, 2007-08-20 14:15 | Permalink

Comment

Welester,
It is very posible.

Anna

Lester Alvarado wrote:
Hello there Anna ,

My name is Welester G. Alvarado my Great great Grandfather (Candelario ) was born in Villa de Saltillo in the state of Coahuila his parents were Juan de Alvarado and Maria Pascuala de Luna , Jose Antonio Candelario Alvarado was thier son baptized the 10th of Feb. 1792 . My question is do you think that the Lunas from Tlatenango came up to Coahuila ?

Thanks ,
Welester

> Hi Esperanza,> My Lunas from the 1800's are in my file, they married into my Arellano's, I do however have the entire line of luna's going back to the early 1600's but have not been able to upload my file, I don't know what i am doing wrong. I descend from Bartolome De Luna, son of Francisco De Luna and Maria De tapia, i have some info on His brother Luis De Luna going forward to early 1700's, my line of Luna's in the 1800 's were already in El Teul and Tepechitlan. Let me know if I can help.> Anna> > Latina1955@aol.com wrote:> Hi Anna...> > You mentioned Luna family....I am a Luna from Tlaltenango area...I have > gotten "stuck" with my research regarding that surname....to the early > 1800's....would you mind sharing with our whole board what you have? Many of us have > been able to make family connections because we have uploaded our trees on to > this site!> > Esperanza> Chicagoland area> > >
_________________________________________________________________
Messenger Café — open for fun 24/7. Hot games, cool activities served daily. Visit now.
http://cafemessenger.com?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_AugWLtagline

Updated GEDCOM File-Gus Meza

Published by gusmeza –
Forums
Genealogy Research

FYI

For anyone interested I have in recent days updated my family history
file containing surnames: Miramontes, Sandoval, Samaniego,Llamas,
Bugarin, Luna,Bobadilla, Abila, Escovedo, Chias etc.

Rancho Los Aros (Haros) ties

Published by Linniev2 –
Forums
History, Culture and General Discussion

I looking for anyone with ties to Rancho Los Aros (Haros). My grandmother, Antonia De Haro, was from there and her family - De Haro - have been there since the 1700's. I have some informaiton abt the families from their but would like to find someone else researchin that area.

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Thu, 2007-08-16 07:24 | Permalink

Comment

Linnie:

The Haros were perhaps the first Spanish (well really mestizo) family to permanently settle in Tlaltenango. I imagine that the majority of Haros are descendants of Juan de Miramontes and Maria de Haro y Saucedo who lived in Tlaltenango in the late 1500s and early 1600s. Some children took the name Miramontes, some Haro and some Saucedo so all of these families come from the same root.

Are you talking about el Rancho de los Haros that was part of Tlaltenango or is there a different rancho by the same name in Jerez? The two towns are close to each other and on opposite ends of the same valley and were historically administered as one entity so families moved back and forth, up and down the valley.

If you do a search for Miramontes or Haro on the site you will find lots of background information about the early origins of this family. There are a great number of people in the group researching some branch or other of this family as I imagine that 99% of people from the Tlaltenango area are descendants of the family.

However, genealogy is about working back one generation at a time and documenting each link, so you should begin by prociding the group with the detailed information about your grandmother's date of birth, name of parents, name of spouse, etc. I am sure there are members here who can help you research her ancestors. Tlaltenango records are very good and mostly indexed.

Comment

Arturo,

Apparently there are two Los Haros/ Los Aros. I got to visit the one in the district of Jerez in 2003. We went to the cemetery looking for family plots. Many of the people from El Durazno were buried there since it was closer than Jerez. While at the panteon Los Aros I found a family grave. I saw what looked like a nob and bent down and picked it up, much to my dismay it was a leg bone! That's when I was told that the graves were used for more than one person over a course of time, the bones from the previous burial were put to the foot of the grave and newly deceased person put in it's place. I reburied the leg bone in the grave, said a prayer for the ancestors and was more careful!

Linnie did contact me since I do have her family in my records from the district of Jerez. I have updated my files and put them on Rootsweb.com. Arturo, to update them on this site do I have to delete the present file or do you do that?

thanks for all your help, Linda in B.C.

arturoramos wrote:

Linnie:

The Haros were perhaps the first Spanish (well really mestizo) family to permanently settle in Tlaltenango. I imagine that the majority of Haros are descendants of Juan de Miramontes and Maria de Haro y Saucedo who lived in Tlaltenango in the late 1500s and early 1600s. Some children took the name Miramontes, some Haro and some Saucedo so all of these families come from the same root.

Are you talking about el Rancho de los Haros that was part of Tlaltenango or is there a different rancho by the same name in Jerez? The two towns are close to each other and on opposite ends of the same valley and were historically administered as one entity so families moved back and forth, up and down the valley.

If you do a search for Miramontes or Haro on the site you will find lots of background information about the early origins of this family. There are a great number of people in the group researching some branch or other of this family as I imagine that 99% of people from the Tlaltenango area are descendants of the family.

However, genealogy is about working back one generation at a time and documenting each link, so you should begin by prociding the group with the detailed information about your grandmother's date of birth, name of parents, name of spouse, etc. I am sure there are members here who can help you research her ancestors. Tlaltenango records are very good and mostly indexed.

Comment

To All,

I have been following recent discussions--particularly those related to the Herrera surname in Tlatenango--and would like to know if there had been?much migration from Tlaltenango to?Momax. My paternal grandmother was a Herrera, and while I'm sure the surname is common in this particular region the possibility of a connection between my grandmother's family and the Herreras being discussed is intriguing to me.

Tony Diaz

-----Original Message-----
From: arturoramos
To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 9:24 am
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Rancho de los Haros

Linnie:

The Haros were perhaps the first Spanish (well really mestizo) family to
permanently settle in Tlaltenango. I imagine that the majority of Haros are
descendants of Juan de Miramontes and Maria de Haro y Saucedo who lived in
Tlaltenango in the late 1500s and early 1600s. Some children took the name
Miramontes, some Haro and some Saucedo so all of these families come from the
same root.

Are you talking about el Rancho de los Haros that was part of Tlaltenango or is
there a different rancho by the same name in Jerez? The two towns are close to
each other and on opposite ends of the same valley and were historically
administered as one entity so families moved back and forth, up and down the
valley.

If you do a search for Miramontes or Haro on the site you will find lots of
background information about the early origins of this family. There are a
great number of people in the group researching some branch or other of this
family as I imagine that 99% of people from the Tlaltenango area are descendants
of the family.

However, genealogy is about working back one generation at a time and
documenting each link, so you should begin by prociding the group with the
detailed information about your grandmother's date of birth, name of parents,
name of spouse, etc. I am sure there are members here who can help you research
her ancestors. Tlaltenango records are very good and mostly indexed.

Comment

Tony:

There need not be migration from Tlaltenango to Momax since Momax was basically one of the pueblos or ranchos of the Tlaltenango jurisdiccion and parrish until the late 1700s, just like Atolinga and Tepechitlan. If you look at a map you will notice that Momax is basically a stone's throw away from the present day city of Tlaltenango... even closer to some of the ranchos we have been discussing. Nowadays it is perhaps a 10 or 15 minute drive... back then it was perhaps a few hours horse ride or a half day's walk...

You should definitely try to find your grandmother's connection to this line. Do you have her birthdate and/or names of her parents?

Comment

Tony,

What other surnames are you researching from Momax?

Pat Silva Corbera

ripped65@aol.com wrote:
To All,

I have been following recent discussions--particularly those related to the Herrera surname in Tlatenango--and would like to know if there had been?much migration from Tlaltenango to?Momax. My paternal grandmother was a Herrera, and while I'm sure the surname is common in this particular region the possibility of a connection between my grandmother's family and the Herreras being discussed is intriguing to me.

Tony Diaz

-----Original Message-----
From: arturoramos
To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thu, 16 Aug 2007 9:24 am
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Rancho de los Haros

Linnie:

The Haros were perhaps the first Spanish (well really mestizo) family to
permanently settle in Tlaltenango. I imagine that the majority of Haros are
descendants of Juan de Miramontes and Maria de Haro y Saucedo who lived in
Tlaltenango in the late 1500s and early 1600s. Some children took the name
Miramontes, some Haro and some Saucedo so all of these families come from the
same root.

Are you talking about el Rancho de los Haros that was part of Tlaltenango or is
there a different rancho by the same name in Jerez? The two towns are close to
each other and on opposite ends of the same valley and were historically
administered as one entity so families moved back and forth, up and down the
valley.

If you do a search for Miramontes or Haro on the site you will find lots of
background information about the early origins of this family. There are a
great number of people in the group researching some branch or other of this
family as I imagine that 99% of people from the Tlaltenango area are descendants
of the family.

However, genealogy is about working back one generation at a time and
documenting each link, so you should begin by prociding the group with the
detailed information about your grandmother's date of birth, name of parents,
name of spouse, etc. I am sure there are members here who can help you research
her ancestors. Tlaltenango records are very good and mostly indexed.

Comment

From my research the Ranch is North of Jerez on the road towards Fresnillo from Jerez into the mountains. All civil documents that were filed for Bith, Death and Marriage were filed in Jerez. I have not been there. However from a book listing Ranches from that area I understand that it is a working farm with a population of abt 800 plus. Several of the De Luna family still farm there. They married into the De Haro's and now live in St. Helena CA. but go back to harvest each year.
My mom had gone there several times. However she passed away before I was able to go on a trip there with her. I hope to go one day.
At the Main Family History Center in Salt Lake City The civil and church records are on micro film from Jerez and that is where I have gleened most of my information.
I have uploaded a GEDCOM file but I need to make to corrections.
Linnie

Comment

I replied to Linnie personally but wanted to add one of the features of Los Haros/Los Aros is the cemetery/panteon. It's centrally located for many rancho's such as El Durazno, Los Rodartes, Santa Rita and others so many of those families buried in Los Haros instead of Jerez as my family did. It's a small town on flat land as most of the ranchos are. They have fields and orchards around them. Some have cattle ranch's since they still raise bulls, I think for the bull fights since they seemed to be very agressive even when very young. Good roads much history still there.

Linda in B.C.

Linniev2 wrote:

>From my research the Ranch is North of Jerez on the road towards Fresnillo from Jerez into the mountains. All civil documents that were filed for Bith, Death and Marriage were filed in Jerez. I have not been there. However from a book listing Ranches from that area I understand that it is a working farm with a population of abt 800 plus. Several of the De Luna family still farm there. They married into the De Haro's and now live in St. Helena CA. but go back to harvest each year.
My mom had gone there several times. However she passed away before I was able to go on a trip there with her. I hope to go one day.
At the Main Family History Center in Salt Lake City The civil and church records are on micro film from Jerez and that is where I have gleened most of my information.
I have uploaded a GEDCOM file but I need to make to corrections.
Linnie

Boronda/Voronda

Published by Visitor (not verified) –
Forums
History, Culture and General Discussion

Comments

Published by gusmeza – Thu, 2007-08-16 10:47 | Permalink

Comment

Gus Meza

I ran across an old posting (22 Feb 2006) regarding the search for the surname Boronda in Jerez. I lived in Monterey County for most of my life having been born in Salinas and am somewhat familiar with early California history there. The Boronda family were early California settlers from Jerez, Zacatecas. They are incorrectly listed by one local historical account as being from Jerez, Spain. There is a reasonably maintained adobe house called the Boronda Adobe once owned by the last family member Eusebio on the outskirts of Salinas, California aptly called the Boronda district. The family once owned a good sized land parcel there. You can find information online in the early California-Monterey County historical accounts.

Gus

Published by calaisvt2002 (not verified) – Thu, 2006-02-23 07:30 | Permalink

Comment

Thank you, Emilie. I had seen Maria Josepha VORONDA. I
usually try Boronda, Borunda, Baranda, Voronda, Vorunda
(and I think I may have a few other spellings on my list).
It is good to know the common spelling in Mexico. Thank
you for all of this information.
Kim

On Wed, February 22, 2006 9:10 pm, Emilie Garcia said:
> Kim,
> Have you seen the one listed in the FamilySearch.com IGI?
> Her name is Maria Josefa de la Santisima Trinidad Voronda,
>
> I find that this name is usually spelled Borunda
> in Mexico. The records of the Spanish Archives for
> passengers to the new world show only one person by that
> name, Gonzalo Borunda, who came to the Dominican Republic
> in the 1500s.
>
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA ---

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ranchos/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
ranchos-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Prudencio Herrera

Published by lunalatina1955 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

In a message dated 8/15/2007 10:32:37 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
arturo.ramos2@gmail.com writes:

There is a Prudencio Herrera, soltero who appears in the census under Rancho
de Michaela Ponce, but just squeezed in at the end and the next rancho is

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Thu, 2007-08-16 06:56 | Permalink

Comment

Esperanza:

The census does not record the castes of the people it lists. It does seperate out the "barrios y pueblos" de naturales or indios from the rest, however. So basically, it begins with a listing of the espanoles, mulatos, mestizos in the town of Tlaltenango itself, then goes through each of the non-indio ranchos and then begins with the barrios de indios in the town of Tlaltenango and finally goes into each of the pueblos de indios that were part of the jurisdiccion, such as Tocatic, Cicacalco, Teocaltiche, etc.

In the non-indio part of the census, there are a number of people described as "esclavos" which I am presuming were mulatos or negros, however for the remainder there is no way to tell whether they were espanoles, mestizos, lobos, etc. There are also no ages, but there is some letter coding system that I have yet to figure out. However, I am guessing that it shows those who are adults vs. those who aren't as some people are not included in the "count".

I have uploaded one of the Ranchos de las Ranas page to the Albums section of the site:

http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/16191

Rancho las Ranas

Published by lunalatina1955 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Wow, thanks for this information. Pedro Prudencio Marin de Herrera
originated in this little rancho and was married several times during the mid
1700's....one of his wives was a Bugarin and one was an Estrada. Who knows, we might

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Mon, 2007-08-13 19:34 | Permalink

Comment

Esperanza, et al.

The Tlaltenango 1754 census has two listings for Rancho de las Ranas. This is the second listing:

Pedro Bugarin, casado
Maria Gonzalez, su mujer
Ventura Bugarin, su hija
Nicolas Bugarin, su hijo
Pedro Bugarin, su hijo
Juan de Bugarin, su hijo
Maria de Bugarin, su hija
Juan Bautista, su hijo
Xavier Bugarin, su hijo
Juan Perez, su sirviente
Joseph Regino, arrimado

Comment

Arturo, Un gran abrazo to you for being so generous with your time, and sharing your knowledge. Pedro Bugarin is in my direct line, and I believe with others in the group. I did not have any idea they were from Las Ranas.
Again, Gracias....Gracias....Helyn

arturoramos wrote:

Esperanza, et al.

The Tlaltenango 1754 census has two listings for Rancho de las Ranas. This is the second listing:

Pedro Bugarin, casado
Maria Gonzalez, su mujer
Ventura Bugarin, su hija
Nicolas Bugarin, su hijo
Pedro Bugarin, su hijo
Juan de Bugarin, su hijo
Maria de Bugarin, su hija
Juan Bautista, su hijo
Xavier Bugarin, su hijo
Juan Perez, su sirviente
Joseph Regino, arrimado

---------------------------------
Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join Yahoo!'s user panel and lay it on us.

Comment

Esperanza:

I think we had discussed our shared lineage through the Bugarin line. Pedro Bugarin is also my direct ancestor through my maternal grandfather. I had a few of his children in my database but I was not aware that he was so prolific until I saw this census record. I will put the remainder of his children in my database as well as the scan of this part of the census.

http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/getperson.php?personID=I1427

Comment

Arturo,

This is a great find, and I'm glad to hear that you will be placing the census record in your data info. My husband is also a direct decendant from this BUGARIN/GONSALES line.
Thank you for passing this along to the group. Do you have any photos of this line? I posted some photos of my husband's Bugarin line and from what I understand there are more BUGAS from this line in Tepic, Nayarit and Chihuahua, Chihuahua.
Gracias, Yolanda

arturoramos wrote:

Esperanza:

I think we had discussed our shared lineage through the Bugarin line. Pedro Bugarin is also my direct ancestor through my maternal grandfather. I had a few of his children in my database but I was not aware that he was so prolific until I saw this census record. I will put the remainder of his children in my database as well as the scan of this part of the census.

http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/getperson.php?personID=I1427

Comment

Gus Meza

Arturo

Thanks for the extracted information of the 1754 Census. Pedro Bugarin and Maria Josepha Gonsales are my fifth great-grandparents. I recently found that they had "cuates" or fraternal twins Joseph Dionisio and Francisco Dionisio both born in Las Ranas 8 Apr 1747 but baptized in Tepechitlan on 23 Apr 1747. I am related to Joseph Dionisio who married Maria Gavriela de Luna whose daughter Maria Antonia Marcial de Luna (born 30 Jun 1789 in Las Ranas) married Jose Luis Lufano Sandoval on 07 Jan 1804 in Atolinga. They had at least eight children one of them being Jose Teodoro Bugarin Sandoval (born in Las Ranas 03 Oct 1820) who married Juliana Miramontes Flores (from Rancho las Ranas) on 18 Sep 1844 in Atolinga. I actually have an old picture of Jose Teodoro given to me by my late cousin, Amador Rodriguez Sandoval who died last year and was a well known history buff in Tlaltenango.

What I can't figure out is why neither Joseph Dionisio or Francisco Dionisio appear on this census? Do you have any ideas?

Thanks again,

Gus Meza

Comment

Gus:

If you are descended from Pedro Bugarin and Maria Josepha Gonzalez, that would make us cousins. You would also be cousin with a few other people in the group descended from the same couple.

As for the cuates not appearing on the census, I imagine that perhaps small children were not listed. It is a shame, because the reason why I took on the project was to try to locate Joseph Ramon Aranzazu, my direct paternal ancestor born around 1750 supposedly in Tlaltenango, but he does not appear in the census either.

Comment

Gus & Arturo, Hello Distant Cousins, we certainly have common ancestors.
Gus, when I was in Tlaltenango, about two years ago, a cousin in town recommended that I visit with his friend, Professor Amador Rodriguez Sandoval, which I did. Professor Rodriguez was so delighted that we were there to see him, and happy to share some of his vast knowledge.

We were all spellbound by this extraordinary person, he did not want us to leave, but he was frail, and we did not want him to overextend himself. As I got up to leave, Professor Rodriguez held my hand, and had me promise that I would send him a hearing aid.

Shortly thereafter, Arturo so generously took the hearing device for me on his trip to Tlaltenango. Sadly, Professor Rodriguez had passed on between our trips.

Gus, hopefully, you will post the photo of Jose Teodoro. What is the Bugarin connection to Professor Rodriguez ?

I also noticed, that not all of Pedro Bugarin's children, born prior to 1754 were not listed in the census.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
Helyn

gusmeza wrote:

Gus Meza

Arturo

Thanks for the extracted information of the 1754 Census. Pedro Bugarin and Maria Josepha Gonsales are my fifth great-grandparents. I recently found that they had "cuates" or fraternal twins Joseph Dionisio and Francisco Dionisio both born in Las Ranas 8 Apr 1747 but baptized in Tepechitlan on 23 Apr 1747. I am related to Joseph Dionisio who married Maria Gavriela de Luna whose daughter Maria Antonia Marcial de Luna (born 30 Jun 1789 in Las Ranas) married Jose Luis Lufano Sandoval on 07 Jan 1804 in Atolinga. They had at least eight children one of them being Jose Teodoro Bugarin Sandoval (born in Las Ranas 03 Oct 1820) who married Juliana Miramontes Flores (from Rancho las Ranas) on 18 Sep 1844 in Atolinga. I actually have an old picture of Jose Teodoro given to me by my late cousin, Amador Rodriguez Sandoval who died last year and was a well known history buff in Tlaltenango.

What I can't figure out is why neither Joseph Dionisio or Francisco Dionisio appear on this census? Do you have any ideas?

Thanks again,

Gus Meza

---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha!
Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.

Published by arturoramos – Fri, 2007-08-10 05:08 | Permalink

Comment

Esperanza:

I think I found your family but in another Rancho... Rancho de los Loera. Here is Pedro Marin de Herrera and his family as they appear in the 1754 census:

Pedro Marin de Herrera, casado
Ana Ventura Garcia, su mujer
Santos Marcelo , su hijo
Pedro de Herrera, su hijo
Maria de Herrera, su hija
Bernardo de Arroyo, su yerno
Maria Casilda , su mujer

Published by arturoramos – Thu, 2007-08-09 13:14 | Permalink

Comment

Esperanza:

I am extracting the 1754 Tlaltenango Census and ran across Rancho de las Ranas. Here is the list of people listed under that Rancho in that year:

Juan Antonio de Herrera, casado
Lugarda de los Santos , su mujer
Juan Pedro de Herrera, su hermano
Diego de Avila, casado
Maria Prudencia , su mujer
Maria , su concinera
Luis Florencio de Herrera, casado
Maria Tiburcia , su mujer
Calletano Valencio , su hermano
Petra Rondana, viuda

Comment

Juan Antonio Herrera
spouse: Lugarda de Los Santos Orosco
child: Francisco Xavier Herrera Orosco
born: 05 Dec 1750 - Tlaltenango - batch C600896

Luis Florencio Herrera
(parents: Calletano Herrera & Ana de Santiago)
married: 11 July 1752 - Tlaltenango - batch M607139
spouse: Maria Tiburcia Peres de Texeda
(her parents: Francisco Xavier Peres de Texeda and
Luiza Regina de Leon)

None of the above are in my line, nor in my data base.
Saludos/hs

arturoramos wrote:

Esperanza:

I am extracting the 1754 Tlaltenango Census and ran across Rancho de las Ranas. Here is the list of people listed under that Rancho in that year:

Juan Antonio de Herrera, casado
Lugarda de los Santos , su mujer
Juan Pedro de Herrera, su hermano
Diego de Avila, casado
Maria Prudencia , su mujer
Maria , su concinera
Luis Florencio de Herrera, casado
Maria Tiburcia , su mujer
Calletano Valencio , su hermano
Petra Rondana, viuda

Rancho de las Ranas - Marin de Herrera

Published by lunalatina1955 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Arturo,

I wonder how close the two ranchos (de las Ranas and Loera)? It appears
that the two families had a connection....now to unravel the mystery....

Thanks for keeping me in mind Arturo.

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Mon, 2007-08-13 09:48 | Permalink

Comment

Esperanza:

The two ranchos appear right after each other. Often times the definition of ranchos is fluid, in the sense that they would basically be a group of houses built by families who had farmland or grazing land nearby. The fact that Ranchos de la Ranas had such few inhabitants in this census and then became an important rancho in later years leads me to believe that it "absorbed" nearby ranchos... perhaps that of los Loera. I would suspect that the families that lived in the two Ranchos were related.

Comment

In a message dated 8/10/2007 7:08:59 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
arturo.ramos2@gmail.com writes:
(1754) census:

Pedro Marin de Herrera, casado
Ana Ventura Garcia, su mujer
Santos Marcelo , su hijo
Pedro de Herrera, su hijo
Maria de Herrera, su hija
Bernardo de Arroyo, su yerno
Maria Casilda , su mujer

I am wondering if Pedro de Herrera, su hijo is the same Pedro Prudencio de
Herrera who married in 1757 to Nicolaza Paula de Estrada SanMartin....although,
I have down that he was previously married to Ana Arrellano...but all this
is still possible, in lieu of the dates (1754...1757)

Another tidbit that I picked up is that Pedro Prudencio de Marin de Errera's
father might have been "Luis Marin de Errera...who would have married Maria
Roza Serano around 1757 as well (probably one of the many wives).

Back to the drawing board....
Thanks Arturo.....
Esperanza

************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at
http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour

Rancho de las Ranas - Bugarin

Published by lunalatina1955 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Yep...this is where Helyn's Herrera's line and mine separate....Pedro was
married at least four times...and Bugarin was one of the wives....I am so happy
for you Helyn....Arturo helped you break the cycle....

Ruiz de Esparza Family 1500's

Published by mendezdetorres –
Forums
Genealogy Research

I was recently surfing on Family Search and found the place where Lope Ruiz de Esparza originated from has several films from the 1500's. Ciudad Esparza, Pamplona, Navarre, Espana. Has anyone ever ordered this film. Its possible that Lope Sr. or his grandfather Martin Ruis de Esparza, or grt gf Simon Ruis de Esparza might be in this film

Comments

Published by cnndominguez – Mon, 2007-08-13 17:00 | Permalink

Comment

These sound like films I MUST order. I had never thought to order films
from Esparza. I found some family members in the Pamplona parish
registers when I researched at the Archbishop's archives in
Pamplona...not in the cathedral's books, but in a smaller parish further
out. But I never spent enough time there to actually find Lope. Perhaps
his baptismal is in these Esparza films.

Thanks!

----- Original Message -----
From: mormonboy74
Date: Monday, August 13, 2007 2:09 pm
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Ruiz de Esparza Family 1500's
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

>
> I was recently surfing on Family Search and found the place where
> Lope Ruiz de Esparza originated from has several films from the
> 1500's. Ciudad Esparza, Pamplona, Navarre, Espana. Has anyone ever
> ordered this film. Its possible that Lope Sr. or his grandfather
> Martin Ruis de Esparza, or grt gf Simon Ruis de Esparza might be in
> this film
>
> Bautismos 1535-1698 Matrimonios 1564-1698 Defunciones 1569-1698 -
> FHL INTL Film [ 1361494 Item 5 ]
>
> These are the ones that might be use to us. There are about 5
> others that might help track down other relatives.
>
> Im thinking of ordering them myself sometime in the future to find
> Lope Ruiz de Esparza's Baptism. and His parents, Marriage.
>
>
> -Daniel Mendez del Camino
>

List of Esparzian Films

Published by mendezdetorres –
Forums
Genealogy Research

These are films for Ciudad Esparza, where the Ruiz de Esparzas were seated in acient times at the Palacios de Esparza. Hope thisis useful to other members! -Daniel Mendez del Camino

Title
Registros parroquiales, 1535-1981

Aguascalientes Films

Published by cnndominguez –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Daniel,

Here are the film numbers and information I promised:

Indefinite Films:

Aguascalientes, Aguas.
#0299421 - Baptisms 1616-1660
#0299422 - Baptisms 1663-1684
#0299423 - Baptisms 1684-1691

Comments

Published by mendezdetorres – Sun, 2007-08-12 23:30 | Permalink

Comment

Hello, Connie! Thanks for your Time. If you could look this up for the
Calvillo films, Id appreciate it alot! Although I dont think Mateo might be
there, but just to make sure. I think he might be on the next film after
yours since the year 1847 splits maybe?
Mateo Rodriguez de Velasco 22 Oct 1847
Petra Basquez de Esparza 2 Feb 1845

I would also like if you could look up Nicolas Diaz de Tiscareno from your
Aguas Film.

Nicolas Dias de Tiscareno 2 Mar 1706
Thanks A Lot! -If you ever need anything let me know. P.S. The Tiscarenos
you sent me are related! -Daniel Mendez del Camino

_________________________________________________________________
Messenger Café — open for fun 24/7. Hot games, cool activities served daily.
Visit now. http://cafemessenger.com?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_AugHMtagline

Rancho de las Ranas

Published by lunalatina1955 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Arturo,
I can't be absolutely sure of course, but it looks like this may be a strong
connection to my family line. The "acta" that I have definitely states that
Pedro was from the Rancho de las Ranas, but I also have bumped into the fact

My New Genealogy File Uploaded

Published by Corrine Ardoin –
Forums
History, Culture and General Discussion

Hi, Everyone:

Well, I finally got it right. I updated my genealogy folder and uploaded
new files that contain descendancy charts for my Martin del Campo, Cabral,
and Robles ancestors in Jalisco. I have been making steady progress in

Does anyone have Aguasscalientes films on loan?

Published by mendezdetorres –
Forums
Genealogy Research

I would like to ask if someone could look this up for me...Please!

Jose Gregorio Lopes de Elisalde
and
Maria de la Merced de Palafox
Married November 30 1791
in Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

Comments

Published by cnndominguez – Thu, 2007-08-09 15:15 | Permalink

Comment

Daniel,

I'm sorry I haven't written. I have looked for the Dias de Tiscareno
group and haven't found as much as I would've liked. However, I did
find a few items that I will try to send out tonight when I get home.
I can't remember what led me to think that someone else other than the
person you mentioned was the originator of that line, but there was
something, somewhere. I know that's silly, but I've got that gut
feeling that I once saw evidence leading me to someone else. It's
irritating, though, because I've been away from it so long that I
can't remember the lines clearly and I have so much data that's just
running around loose!

Regarding films... I've got 0299421, 0299422, 0299423, 02998??
(marriages), 0299856 (burials) and a few more I can't remember off
hand. I will also check when I get home and send the complete list to
all.

Connie

----- Original Message -----
From: mormonboy74
Date: Wednesday, August 8, 2007 11:06 pm
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Does anyone have Aguasscalientes films on
loan?
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

>
> I would like to ask if someone could look this up for me...Please!
>
> Jose Gregorio Lopes de Elisalde
> and
> Maria de la Merced de Palafox
> Married November 30 1791
> in Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico
>
>
> Thanks for the help! -Daniel Mendez del Camino

[General] My Genealogy File

Published by Corrine Ardoin –
Forums
History, Culture and General Discussion

I have updated my genealogy file. However, I don't seem to be able to get
the new file into my file folder. I deleted the original one, then when I
tried to upload the new one, it would come out as a shortcut file, just

Adding a Municipality to a State in the Films Section

Published by ayalarobles –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Arturo,

For Coahuila, please add the following municipalities- Saltillo, General Cepeda, Allende, Nava,
Ramos Arispe

For Nuevo Leon add Monterrey, Guadalupe, Villaldama, Lampazos, Vallecillo, Cadereyta

Comments

Published by arturoramos – Fri, 2007-08-03 07:08 | Permalink

Comment

Esther:

I have added all of the municipalities that you requested. I added one film for Vallecillo in Nuevo Leon so that state will show up on the state listing. The other states were already there because there were films listed for them already.

Let me know if you have any further questions regarding this. Thank you for taking the time to add to the database.

film info on Nuestros Ranchos

Published by chula801 –
Forums
Genealogy Research

Could anyone please explain to me the purpose of the
film info on the site? I'm not really sure what we
are supposed to do with it, but I assume it is
beneficial for looking up info? I'm sorry if this is

Comments

Comment

Esther,

For Jalisco, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes, all of the municipalities are already in the database. If the municipality does not show up on the list when you click on a state that means that there are no films for that municipality in the database yet. If you want to add the first film for a municipality, select the name of the municipality from the menu on the bottom of the page (below the list of municipalities for which there are already films).

If you would like to add a municipality for a state not in our region, let me know which municipality and I can add it manually to the database.

Published by Maureen Bejar – Sat, 2007-07-21 21:04 | Permalink

Comment

Dear Lavaniya:
The LDS has some of its film records extracted and put into search capable databases. In other words, you can click on the links in the film section and be taken to the LDS database for this film. You can then put your ancestor's name in the search and hit enter or you can just hit enter and you will be able to scroll through the records to see if any of your ancestors are on this film (click the next button at the bottom of each page to get to the next page). Sometimes it is better to scroll through as various spellings sometimes makes it impossible to match a name. For instance I was putting in Geronima Ledesma and getting no results because within the LDS record the name was Jeronima DeLedesma.

Without this link you must use trial and error trying to figure out which of the microfilms for a particular area have been put into the online databases. The LDS has many records in their search databases, but not all of their microfilms have been completed. The films section lets us know exactly which ones are in the database. I actually did the trial and error method before I stumbled on this site! I would guess the next batch number by using consecutive numbers. This works sometimes, but other times there are gaps.

So with this in mind, do not think the LDS does not have records you are looking for if you do not find a match on their site. Only a small fraction of their information is on the database. It sometimes may be necessary to go to their library catalog and search on an area, for example San Miguel or Valle de Guadalupe to find out all the microfilms available.

Once again thank you and thank goodness for the films section on this site!!!

Comment

Well, that's sounds just great! If only I can figure out how to use it... So, how do I get into the database to search through the film? I clicked on films, then the region (Jalisco), then Mascota and 3 films showed up. I clicked on the film and it only gave me a choice to edit or submit a film. Maybe I'm in the wrong place? I really appreciate your help!
Lavaniya

Comment

Do not click the actual film number, click the box next to the number called IGI.

I was mistaken though. It does not allow you to search by name, only to scroll through.

However if you know the film number and batch number, then you can go into a search, replace the film number and batch number to the one you want and be able to search by name.

Comment

By the way, when you get into the IGI then click on the persons name to see more information, such as parents in baptisms or parents and spouse in marriage documents. Hope this helps.

Comment

> Could anyone please explain to me the purpose of the film info on the site?

Are you referring to the list which shows which list members have films on permanent loan at their local LDS Family History Centers?

I assumed it was so list members could ask someone to look up information. I'm certainly willing to do that with the films to which I have access. The extracted records do not include all the data found on the microfilmed records.

~Deena Ortiz~
Rancho Cucamonga, CA

Subscribe to