Nuestros Ranchos Site

Hello everyone,

Before I viewed the record image, I had already made my deduction about this case. The Covarrubias' family has been native of Jalisco since the era of the first settlers of that state's region.

I looked through the document, with all my experience in the subject and by the fact that my mother language is Spanish and can tell you that your ancestor wasn't a peninsular spanish, the document is a little bit fuzzy but I can read that he was from "Exutla", the modern writing writes it Ejutla and it's actually a municipality in Jalisco. But also, on the left side of the record it states "españoles de este pueblo" so it meant both of them were from Tecolotlán. In order to be sure about the origin of your ancestor you should look for his baptism certificate, what we're a 100% sure is that he wasn't from Spain.

I descend from the Covarrubias family and I can tell you that at least you would not connect this ancestor back to Spain for 200 years before that date.

Good luck with your research, I would like to add that I descend from that family but I'm not an expert with it, I think there any more members in this group that can help you more than me in the case of this family, hope that they read your message. However, if you have any other doubt let me know.

Enrique

Mabel,
I too have this couple in my family tree. Thank you for finding their marriage record. As is read it, after his name it reads "de este pueblo" in an abbreviated form. That means he was born in Tecolotlan. Let's see what others think.
Lucy Sweeney

I found the following in a PDF about Loreto, Zacatecas. It looks like Montesa was a cathedral in Pinos, Zacatecas that used to be in the parish of San Marias del Real in Pinos, but I don't understand the Spanish very well.

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA

Los volúmenes de registros de nacimientos, matrimonios y entierros de los siglos
XVII, XVIII y XIX dan testimonio de la extensa actividad religiosa que la capilla tuvo, (llegó
a registrar repetidos servicios diarios) colocándole como importante Auxiliar de la
Parroquia de San Matías del Real de Pinos, de la que dependió desde su origen; después
al erigirse La Montesa en Parroquia en 1904, quedó en su demarcación; el año de
1922 fue disgregada dicha Parroquia de San Antonio de la Montesa y la capilla quedó a
control de Noria de Ángeles; que desde 1883 se erigió como Parroquia de la Purísima
Concepción, a la que perteneció hasta el 15 de diciembre de 1956 en que la vicaría fija
de la exhacienda de La Concepción fue elevada a Parroquia, a la que pertenece hasta
la fecha dentro de la Diócesis de Zacatecas.

> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: m.caraveo@sbcglobal.net
> Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2012 18:34:15 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] La Montesa Filegresa de Pinos
>
> Greetings:
>
> Need help in locating where is La Montesa, filegresa de pinos, Trying to locate baptismal for Agapito Aguilar Yzquierdo. Some of my records,that I have found in Cienega de Mata. Jalisco, state, this location And Also Same Family as being from el Xaral del Valle, I've been try to locate these places for a long time without sucess. Please, Please Help. Thank You very much in advance
>
> Mary Caraveo

Mary
You will find all images related to that surnames both Pinos and Asientos parishes

> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: m.caraveo@sbcglobal.net
> Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2012 18:34:15 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] La Montesa Filegresa de Pinos
>
> Greetings:
>
> Need help in locating where is La Montesa, filegresa de pinos, Trying to locate baptismal for Agapito Aguilar Yzquierdo. Some of my records,that I have found in Cienega de Mata. Jalisco, state, this location And Also Same Family as being from el Xaral del Valle, I've been try to locate these places for a long time without sucess. Please, Please Help. Thank You very much in advance
>
> Mary Caraveo

Maternal grandpatents:
Leon Galvan
Leonides Lamas
Padrinos: Francisco Acosta y Juana Marquez
Marriage Record:

Leon Galvan
Leonor Lamas
Antonio Marquez
Nazaria Flores
Toribio Galvan 37 years old he's widower Anacleta Sandoval 7 years
Margarita Marquez 23 years old
Padrinos Juan Jose Galvan y Maria Ignacia Galvan
Witness Pascual Cabral y Eleuterio Leon

On Mon, Jul 30, 2012 at 12:10 AM, wrote:

> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm so excited because I found my great great grandmother's baptismal
> certificate, now we move into Huejucar, Jalisco, when just about everyone
> else was from Zacatecas.
>
> This is her baptismal certificate (bottom left side):
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.3.1/TH-1-18455-33928-21?**
> cc=1874591&wc=12506361
>
> Parents: Toribio Galvan
> Margarita Marquez
>
> Paternal grandparents:
> Leon Galvan
> Leonides ??
>
> Maternal grandparents:
> Antonio Marquez
> Nasaria Villegas
>
>
> However, her parents' marriage record looks to have different names (upper
> right).
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.3.1/TH-1-18688-39540-92?**
> cc=1874591&wc=12506867
>
> Paternal grandparents:
> Leon Galvan
> Leonora ??
>
> Maternal grandparents:
> Antonio Marquez
> Nasaria Flores??
>
> Also, this appears to be Toribio's second marriage, he's a widower of
> Anacleta Sandoval?? Are the people at bottom the padrinos and witnesses?
>
> Thanks!
> Laura

Cual te interesa de los 9 matrimonios??

Atte:
Mario Gonzalez

El 29/07/2012 07:20 p.m., brixa_911@hotmail.com escribió:
> HOLA MUY BUEN FIN DE SEMANA A TODOS Y SIGO CON MI INVESTIGACÍON Y ME
> GUSTARÍA SABER QUE ES LO QUE DICE EN ESTE MATRIMONIO PARA LOGRAR SABER
> SI ES MI LINEA ? SI HAY ALGUIEN QUE ME PUEDA AUXILIAR LO AGRADECERÉ
> INFINITAMENTE.
> ESTE ES EL LINK.
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18564-59511-28?cc=1874591&wc…
>

The matrimonios only included the names of the bride and groom, their
calidad, at times their place of origin, sometimes their parents, the
witnesses, and the padrinos of the marriage.

The información matrimonial was a process called for by the Council of
Trent where the bride and groom declared their age, calidad, their place of
origin, their parents, and a previous marriage if there was one. They also
had to declare they were free to marry and didn't have the impediments of
consanguinity or affinity relationship, haven't promised to marry another
person, no criminal convictions, no promise of celibacy or to belong to a
religious order. The bride also declares she is marrying voluntarily and
isn't being forced pr coerced to marry. The información matimonial will
also have three witnesses that declare they have known the bride and/or
groom for a number of years and that everything that they know what the
bride and groom have said is known to be true. At times the witnesses are
related to the bride or groom and they state the relationship and that the
relationship isn't keeping them from stating the truth. Sometimes a detail
comes out that wasn't known about a consanguineal relationship and then the
process for a dispensa is started. If the bride and groom are from
different towns then two different información matrimonial records would be
created, one for each town. Both should be attempted to be found since one
can have info the other does not.

At times the matrimonial record can't be found but the información
matrimonial can be found which gives even more info to begin with.
Therefore, indexing the información matrimonial records should be given the
same degree of importance as any other record.

Dispensas are yet another record. The dispensas of consanguinidad are
records to ask for permission to marry when they are related within the
past four generations. The dispensas of afinidad are for when a former
spouse is related to a spouse to be. The past two give a lot of valuable
genealogical information. Dispensas de ultramarino are for people that are
originally from overseas. Dispensas had to be authorized by the bishop. The
información matrimonial only had to be authorized by the priest of the
church the bride or groom belonged to.

Familysearch has an explanation in Spanish of información matrimonial with
examples.

http://goo.gl/C1ZU8

Saludos,
Armando

On Fri, Jul 27, 2012 at 11:03 PM, wrote:

> What's the difference besides extra info? Why the difference?
>
> Thanks, Laura Gonzalez

That extra information can sometimes be invaluable. I have seen informacion matrimonial state that the groom had lived in other jurisdictions aside from their home town. In the early 1900's, there was some informacion matrimonial with a dispensation to the groom "de vaguedad" meaning he had been traveling without an official residence, showed he'd lived in Kansas City and other parts of the US.

Different reasons for a dispensa are that the bride and her family were very poor and needed immediate rescue. I find the informaciones matrimoniales full of information we wouldn't be able to get elsewhere.

Alicia

________________________________
From: "mayangrl@sonic.net"
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Friday, July 27, 2012 9:03 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Matrimonios vs. Información Matrimonial

What's the difference besides extra info?  Why the difference?

Thanks, Laura Gonzalez

Who are your Luna's? as I have an extensive file. Also, I have been researching for a friend who's family "Huizar" were from Momax, and Colotlan.
/hs
michael huizar wrote:

i'm lookimg for any one that has info on the luna family in momax

como doy con la lista indexada por Claudia Casillas de las dispensas matrimoniales de la Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara,gracias anticipadas un gran saludos y mis felicitaciones por el trabajo de Claudia Casillas, horas y horas de trabajo
Javier González López Portillo

Hola, Jorge:

Estoy de acuerdo que la obra de Claudia y demás contribuyentes ha sido una
gran labor.

Se que Pedro de Villalobos era hijo de Tomás de Villalobos y Catalina
Macias Valadez y que su primera esposa fue Catalina Ramírez Rubio hija de
Juan Alonso de los Inojos e Isabel Ramírez Rubio pero no sabia que Pedro
tuvo una hija llamada Jacinta. ¿Serás tan amable de compartir el enlace de
la dispensa que menciona a Jacinta? Existe la posibilidad que el Agustín
que fue su marido es el que era hijo de Álvaro Marín de Peñaloza y
Petronila Martínez de Sotomayor bautizado el 27 de marzo 1667 en
Aguascalientes.

Saludos
Armando

On Jul 15, 2012 3:01 PM, "Jorge Luis Ramírez Gómez" <
georgio_2386@hotmail.com> wrote:

>
> Gracias al esfuerzo de Claudia Casillas de indexar las dispensas
> matrimoniales de la Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara, en las publicaciones que
> ha hecho este mes, logré avanzar en dos lineas que tenía pendientes.
> Logré establecer quienes eran los padres de Jacinta de Villalobos, mujer
> de Agustín Marín de Peñaloza. Resulta que es hija de Pedro Villalobos y
> Catalina Rubio, vecinos de Teocaltiche. Ahora solo me falta saber quienes
> eran los padres de Agustín Marín de Peñaloza.
> También logré descubir que Antonia de Anda Altamirano, la mujer de Esteban
> Rodríguez de Asocar, es hija de Juan de Anda Altamirano y de Catalina
> Rodríguez de Salcedo.
> Mi más grande y sincero agradecimiento a Claudia Casillas por su gran
> labor. GRACIAS.
>
> Jorge Luis Ramírez Gómez.
>
> Tepatitlán de Morelos, Jalisco, México.
>
>
>
>
>

Armando:

En un Libro que se llama "De Criolla Estirpe" del profesor Ezequiel Hernandez Lugo, (Cronista por algún tiempo de Encarnacion de Diaz y ahora miembro del Consejo para la Cronica de Lagos de Moreno) en la pagina 86 aparece "Don Luis Romo de Vivar y Ruiz de Esparza", (hijo de Pedro Romo de Vivar y de Lorenza Ruiz de Esparza)".-Casado en Teocaltiche el dos de junio de 1686 con doña Maria de Villalobos y Carrillo."; No lo especifica pero al parecer esta informacion tiene como fuente al Dr Mariano Gonzalez Leal.

Miguel Beltran

Hola Armando,

El acta de matrimonio de Miguel Romo de Vivar y Ana Macias Valadez no menciona a sus padres. Puedes buscarla en FamilySearch Beta Site con el siguiente enlace:

https://www.familysearch.org/s/image/show#uri=http%3A//pilot.familysear…

Sin embargo, su información matrimonial menciona a los padres de Ana Macías Valadez pero no a los de Miguel Romo de Vivar. Como sabes que Miguel Romo de Vivar llevaba como segundo apellido Villalobos? Te agradecería me indicaras la fuente de esa información, ya que hubo más de un Miguel Romo de Vivar. Los padres de Ana Macías Valadez fueron Juan Macías Valadez (ya difunto en 1724) y Juana Hernández. Miguel Romo de Vivar era vecino de la jurisdicción de Lagos y Ana Macías Valadez de Aguascalientes. El enlace es el siguiente:

https://www.familysearch.org/s/image/show#uri=http%3A//pilot.familysear…

Espero tus comentarios. Saludos,

BILL FIGUEROA

I'm not 100% positive, but I'm assuming that's correct.

Laura Gonzalez

According to this site, it's near Tomatlan. http://mexico.pueblosamerica.com/i/gargantillo-la-hacienda/

Laura Gonzalez

gedcom 5.5 is more universal when exporting elsewhere.

export all files on Fanily Tree Maker and choose the option gedcom 5.5 into your computer files. you can now export that gedcom file to Nuestros Ranchos gedcom files or rootsweb.com.

Jose Carlos de Leon

Hi Alice,

The word "agostadero" used in old records is equivalent to "potrero" which
is a grazing field for cattle. While searching for my ancestors in
Aguascalientes, I came across several estancias named "El Agostadero". One
that immediately comes to mind is the "Hacienda del Agostadero" that
belonged to Juana de Siordia, widow of Bernardo Salado. It was later
inherited by her daughter Bernarda Salado. I believe it was located in the
outskirts of Aguascalientes (the town) not far from Hacienda de Peñuelas and
today's International Airport Jesús Terán. You would find those records in
Aguascalientes, not in Asientos. However, it is possible that another
estancia named Agostadero was located near Asientos, but I am not aware of
it.

BILL FIGUEROA

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alice Blake"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2012 3:11 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Agostadero

Does anyone know where mid 1800's Agostadero, Aguascalientes nacimientos or
baptisms would be found? Are they included with Asientos? Thanks so much for
your help. Alice

Hi Alice, It is my understanding that around 1860's La hacienda de Agostadero, El lobo, La Concepcion "La Concha" and Los Campos was incorporated into the city of Villa Garcia, Zacatecas. you can probably find it there, on civil records. On church records you might try Pinos, zacatecas. I hope this is some help to you.
Lance "Gonzo"

The hat type is called a tricorne in both English and Spanish (with their respective pronunciations). I was not aware that those hats were worn in Mexico, that is very interesting.
luissche

It's on image 67

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11594-39727-82?cc=1410092&…

Saludos
Armando

On Fri, Jul 20, 2012 at 3:35 PM, wrote:

> Hello
>
> Desperately seeking the marriage record (image) of
> Leonardo Romo and Josefa Trinidad.
> They are padrinos for a child of Manuel Romo and Maria Ygnacia Rodriguez,
> and I would very much like to see who the parents of Leonardo are.
> Family search gives their marriage as follows:
>
> 04 Feb 1824 Nuestra Senora De La Victoria,Nadadores,Coahuila,**Mexico
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.1.1/JZJB-ZQB
> But when I go to the book for marriages at that place and time, the entry
> is not there:
>
> https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.3.1/TH-267-11594-41481-92?**
> cc=1410092&wc=6816018
> Am I looking in the wrong place? The film number is 222404, but the first
> image of this series of records does not provide the image...
>
> Any good advice?
>
> There are lots of Raphael Romos in and around Aguascalientes, and I am
> still trying to find out which one was the father of Manuel Romo, resident
> of Nadadores/San Buenaventura, but originally from Aguascalientes, he was
> my direct ancestor. Finding out info about Leonardo may help....there were
> several with that name in Family Search, so I really need to see the image!
>
> Regards,
> Denise
>
>

Hello
I too am researching the Romo name. Although I have no links to Jalolstitlan (that I know of), I thought I would suggest that you try "Guadalajara Dispensas" site (just google Guadalajara dispensas. Use the Jauregui name in the search field of their site. Sometimes you strike gold with a marriage dispensation! You get a couple of generations of ancestors. And if you havent been into Gedcom here, try that too of course.

Regards,
Denise

Totally off topic, but every time I read her name, I read "mensa." ;-p

Laura Gonzalez

I have only seen that term in baptismal documents to refer to stillborn or
children that died shortly after birth. "Murió párvulo"

Saludos,
Armando

On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 12:20 PM, wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I discovered one of my relatives, Ana Dominga Martinez, daughter of Jose
> María Martinez and Dorotea Guerra,my 5th great grandparents, was born 04
> Aug 1808, and baptized 09 Aug 18/08 (Nuetra Señora de la Asunción), in San
> Carlos, Nuevo León, MX. She was identified as "Parbula española". Can
> someone enlightened me as to what this term means? It is my first encounter.
>
> Thank you.
>
>
> Paul Gomez
> Rancho Cucamonga, CA
> paul.gomez@verizon.net

Del Diccionario de la Real Lengua Española de 1780-- Párvulo: adj. Lo mismo que PEQUEÑO. Tómase freqüentemente por el niño.

El link para consultar diccioarios españoles antiguos es:
http://web.frl.es/ntllet/SrvltGUILoginNtlletPub

Saludos
Luis A. Valdes

Hi Paul,

If I'm not mistaken, "Parbulo/a" stands for "minor/infant", My Dad still uses the term once in a while to refer to Kindergarden school, he sometimes calls it "escuela para Parbulitos". Hope it helps.

Roberto Hdez

I have the book Ameca Protofundacion Mexicana, I will scan the pages which mention the Ortega's for you and put it here sometime during the week.

topete

Hola a todos:

La información referente al antepasado de Casilda de Ortega Maldonado y Ruiz Galindo ya la conocía desde hace mucho y con mucho gusto se la he pasado a mucha cantidad de personas interesadas en el tema. No me acuerdo si esa información la hice pública en algún foro de este sitio pero fue gracias al arduo trabajo que realizó mi tío Gabriel Agraz García de Alba que el estudio de esta familia y de muchas otras de Tecolotlán y alrededores han arrojado varios datos valiosísimos.

La publicación que hizo mi tío con respecto a los García de Alba fue exclusivamente y especialmente realizada para un tío abuelo y de la cual tengo una copia. Lo relevante acerca de los Ortega es que el pacificador de la Nueva Galicia, Antonio de Ortega Guillén casó con Catalina del Viñar y de esta unión tuvo un nieto llamado Juan de Ortega Maldonado esposo de Juana Ruiz-Galindo, padres que fueron de Casilda de Ortega Maldonado esposa de Francisco García de Alba. Osea que Casilda es bisnieta del primer Ortega. También menciona que toda su familia era miembro de una Cofradía, o sea eran cofrades.

Saludos,
Enrique Agraz

Muchas Gracias !!! Yo soy de esos descendientes de Mariana Clara Casilda
Ortega y Maldonado casada con Francisco Garcia de Alba y Ruiz y creo que
por mas de una rama-

Me encantaría encontrar el documento que la una con Antonio de Ortega!!

Muchas Gracias por compartir la información!

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 4:46 PM, wrote:

> Hello everyone! Just as I found out about the sixteenth-century patriarch
> of the García de Alba family a while back, I have also found the Ortega
> patriarch of that same century. For those of you who have Casilda de Ortega
> Maldonado or Catalina de Ortega Maldonado (both sisters) in your family
> trees, let me inform you that they are both descendants of Antonio de
> Ortega, encomendero and landowner of Colima. I found this out, because
> meanwhile scanning previews of "Ameca protofundación mexicana", I found
> this excerpt:
> "En 1581 obtuvo del virrey conde de Coruña, en Ixtlanejo, un sitio para
> ganado mayor, don Antonio de Ortega; este poblador lo fue de verdad, pues
> fundó una vigorosa familia que mucho significaría en los siglos inmediatos,
> ligada a otras proceres, como fueron Maldonado, Topete, García de Alba,
> Arrióla y Villaseñor."
>
> From "de Ortega", the surname would later evolve into "de Ortega
> Maldonado" thus creating the ancestral family of southern-central Jalisco.
>
> Here is the link to the excerpt
> http://www.google.com/search?**tbm=bks&hl=en&q=ameca+conde+**
> de+coruna+1581&btnG=#hl=en&**tbm=bks&sa=X&psj=1&ei=-x_**
> uT9ahDYHq0gGJgMnNDQ&ved=**0CDEQvwUoAQ&q=En+1581+obtuvo+**
> del+virrey+conde+ortega&spell=**1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf
> .,**cf.osb&fp=7f0cb66b886c04a&biw=**1024&bih=677
>
> ...and here is the link to a biography of Antonio de Ortega
> http://books.google.com/books?**id=AdIs_kXt8zcC&pg=PA376&dq=**
> antonio+de+ortega+andariegos+**y+pobladores+de+nueva+galicia&**
> hl=en&sa=X&ei=3iHuT5uDG--**x0QHUuKzmDQ&ved=0CDYQ6AEwAA#v=**
> onepage&q&f=false
>

Roy,

Congrats! What a find, I am not too familiar with the Choperena family, but it has been established that they are Navarrense, It is also important to look for his Dispensa de Ultramarino in the Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara, a document in which a foreigner or peninsular had to receive permission in order to marry in New Spain. That document will give you lots of new insight in the life of D. Pedro de Choperena, who he was, where he traveled and what he did.

Best of luck,
Daniel Méndez de Torres Camino
São Paulo, Brasiln

Roy,

Joaquín was born in Spain. The marriage document says he was "Español
celibato de 30 años de edad natural de los Reinos de Castilla en el de
Nabarra Obispado de Pamplona en la villa de Aranas h.l. de D. Pedro Jose
Choperena y de D. Maria Bautista Yndart." Natural in this case means
originally. The información matrimonial should also have information from
Spain that the priest in Totatiche would have requested for verification
for him to have an auto (license) to marry.

The marriage of D. Pedro Jose Choperena y de D. Maria Bautista Yndart took
place exactly on 25 Feb 1759 in Aranaz, Navarra.

Armando

On Wed, Jul 11, 2012 at 1:59 PM, wrote:

> With the help of Armando, I have identified my first connection back to
> Spain. About 1759, Pedro de Choperena of Aranaz, Navarra, Spain married to
> Maria Bauptista de Yndart. Upon reaching Mexico, she gave birth to Juaquin
> Choperena born 1771 in Totatiche, Jalisco. Juaquin married Victoriana
> Martinez on 16 Sep 1801.
>
> I have posted a chart in my file folder:
>
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.**com/en/UncleRelic
>
> There are numerous family names that be of interest to the Forum,
> including Larrea, Caballero, Martinez, Avila, Holguin, del Real, Loretto,
> Ortega, Valdes, Escobedo, Pinedo, Ramos,and Viramontes.
>
> Hopefully, someone will find a connection to my line.
> Saludos,
> Roy -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>
> To post, send email to:
> research(at)NuestrosRanchos.**com
>
> To change your subscription, log on to:
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
>

Hi Linda, I believe this is what it says:

"En esta Santa Iglesia Parroquia de Tecpatitlan en veinte y dos de Henero (sic) de mil setecientos ochenta y cinco años: Yo, el presbítero Don José Manuel Olachea como cura interino, dí sepultura eucarística con entierro mayor, cruz alta, siriales, capa, vigilia y misa de cuerpo presente, entierro de cinco pesos, a Don Juachin Romero, español, casado que fue con Doña María Anastasia (?) Gómez. Murio de Tabardillo en este pueblo. Recibió los santos sacramentos de penitencia y extrema unción y para que conste lo firmé.
José Manuel Olachea (rubric)"

Tabardillo is typhus, I think.

SOLO PARA ANIMARTE Y APOYARTE QUE TU TRABAJO, TIEMPO Y DEDICACIÓN SERÁ GRATIFICADO .....SIGUE CON ESE SERVICIO VERÓNICA FELICIDADES ¡¡¡¡YO TAMBIEN AMO A STA. ANITA Y MÁS A NUESTRO MÉXICO.